Oh, what could have been.......

[hoopjunkie]

Our starting lineup IF the portal/NIL didnt exist:


PG--Javian McCollum....14.3ppg...2.9 reb...3.9 assists (Oklahoma)

2G--Jordan King........19.0ppg...4.3 reb...2.4 assists (Richmond)

SF--Colby Rogers.......15.5ppg...3.6 reb...2.0 assists (Wichita State)

PF--Jared Billups........5.4ppg...4.4 reb...1.3 assists (George Mason)

C---Kyle Young.........14.5ppg...7.5 reb...1.8 assists ('22-'23 season @ Flagler)


Imagine this group in Today's MAAC?? LOT of talent there.

[great10110]

Jan 29, 2024 4:08:54 GMT -5 hoopjunkie said:

Our starting lineup IF the portal/NIL didnt exist:


PG--Javian McCollum....14.3ppg...2.9 reb...3.9 assists (Oklahoma)

2G--Jordan King........19.0ppg...4.3 reb...2.4 assists (Richmond)

SF--Colby Rogers.......15.5ppg...3.6 reb...2.0 assists (Wichita State)

PF--Jared Billups........5.4ppg...4.4 reb...1.3 assists (George Mason)

C---Kyle Young.........14.5ppg...7.5 reb...1.8 assists ('22-'23 season @ Flagler)


Imagine this group in Today's MAAC?? LOT of talent there.


Imagine if…. Crazy how fast the sport and the conference has changed in the last 24 months.

[OneIndian]

And I’m sure this is the case Carm will make.

However the entire NCAA is currently playing by the same rules and we’re at or near the bottom of the pack (350 +).

He made huge miscalculations & mailed it in recruiting the last two cycles. Carm left valuable scholarships unfilled, took risky Euro players, left local talent out in the cold and made sketchy 3-1 deals with too much emphasis on walkons.

No excuses we need to move on asap. This program, in its current state, & especially for a 5th year coach is completely unacceptable.

[hoopdad]

The reality is that many of those players were under recruited out of HS/Prep because of the pandemic and most likely would never ended up at Siena. If he is going to use NIL and portal as an excuse, then he needs to acknowledge how he benefited from COVID. I for one believe there are no excuses. He had to deal with these situations just like the other 361 D1 coaches. Many did not fail miserably like he has.

[billmurray]

The landscape changed and the coach took a different path going for HS kids and international players with limited DI talent who were not ready to compete even in the depleted MAAC. Totally wrong decisions and the line up is totally his responsibility. The kids can play as hard as they can and it will not be enough. Sad for them they are put in a no win situation. That's on the coach. He created the disaster and can't "coach" his way out of it. Sadly change is needed. I don't like it, but I think it is the only solution. You don't hire a sales manager and allow him to recruit a sales force that can't close any deal, without cleaning house and starting over.

[feathers]

Honestly I don't blame carm for this. Most teams could assemble a what could've been team. It's too hypothetical. For example, What if Javion doesn't want to come here in the first place because king is established?

Also Rogers just seems like a serial transferer

[glen]

Jan 29, 2024 8:33:53 GMT -5 billmurray said:

The landscape changed and the coach took a different path going for HS kids and international players with limited DI talent who were not ready to compete even in the depleted MAAC. Totally wrong decisions and the line up is totally his responsibility. The kids can play as hard as they can and it will not be enough. Sad for them they are put in a no win situation. That's on the coach. He created the disaster and can't "coach" his way out of it. Sadly change is needed. I don't like it, but I think it is the only solution. You don't hire a sales manager and allow him to recruit a sales force that can't close any deal, without cleaning house and starting over.

Taking kids from wherever is fine. Carm has generally been decent at finding under the radar talent. Unfortunately he had 2 bad years in a row. I still think there are some kids on this roster that are very workable. Unfortunately there are too many that are not. Zek scored great yesterday but in the process had 10 TOs. That is totally unacceptable for a PG. Both he and Courtney are fine as backups, providing a few minutes here and there. They are not primary options. Gio is one of our best bigs (IMO). If he had a Biz / Bennerman / Moore he'd be very good. Imagine Gio + Pickett. Wow.

Carm's attitude killed him. Writing off the portal was suicide. I'm not opposed to foreign kids but Iceland? Really? Did he even see these kids play or did he watch a 10 minute hilight reel where they shoot 100% and have no mistakes? Sorta looks like the latter.

[siena7127]

Carms issue is he took the transfers personal. He should have kept retooling with the portal, he could of added a couple Euro players as they could have brought the stability he wanted but he did not need to go all in on them and abandon the portal.

Also the 1/3 deals are fine with like 1 player a year or 2, not multiple players.

A change would be nice but do we really trust the administration with the hire? Again I think they need to look to proven head coaches at all levels who press and play fast, that is the style we all want to watch. I am just nervous they will hire another assistant, or someone like Mitch, patsos, jamion and carm who are all talk about the style they want to play.

[musicman]

Jan 29, 2024 9:16:46 GMT -5 feathers said:

Honestly I don't blame carm for this. Most teams could assemble a what could've been team. It's too hypothetical. For example, What if Javion doesn't want to come here in the first place because king is established?

Also Rogers just seems like a serial transferer

"Most teams" haven't ended up at the very bottom of DI basketball during this period of "transfer." Most coaches don't have the embarrassing record that Carm has achieved over the last two seasons. That's why he's called the head coach and makes the big bucks. You accept the responsibilities. You get the glory when you won but if you fail at the level as he has in the past two seasons there are consequences.

[iskout]

Jan 29, 2024 8:24:39 GMT -5 hoopdad said:

The reality is that many of those players were under recruited out of HS/Prep because of the pandemic and most likely would never ended up at Siena. If he is going to use NIL and portal as an excuse, then he needs to acknowledge how he benefited from COVID. I for one believe there are no excuses. He had to deal with these situations just like the other 361 D1 coaches. Many did not fail miserably like he has.

I would argue that the only player on this list that was under recruited out of HS was McCollum. You could argue King, too, but he's much more of a "He got better with time" story than being an all star out of HS.

[hoopjunkie]

Jan 29, 2024 9:16:46 GMT -5 feathers said:

Honestly I don't blame carm for this. Most teams could assemble a what could've been team. It's too hypothetical. For example, What if Javion doesn't want to come here in the first place because king is established?

Also Rogers just seems like a serial transferer

Name another team in our conference that could do this. Besides Iona with Pitino recruits who didnt probably belong here in the first place.

This didnt even include losing Pickett and Carey in the portal infancy. We've been affected more than anyone, and our kids not only play at a higher level, they excel.

Carm could recruit. Problem is he didnt adjust to reality and his last 2 classes have proven that. So here we are at the bottom of the league with a bleak future unless some sort of change is ultimately made.

[glen]

Carm wants to build and develop a team. The new paradigm is build a team every year. Long-term development is history. Your only guaranteed roster is the one THIS YEAR. This is especially true with unlimited transfers. You can take a few projects in slots 11-13. Everyone else needs to be competing for time. Sorry if that bums some kids (and our coach) out.

[bigsaintg]

Watching Young’s brother play for Duke now. I like Kyle but I guess he couldn’t get along with Carm

[hoopdad]

IMO, Kyle Young was another D2 caliber player recruited by Carm. I believe his stats at Flagler (which are down this season) prove that. BTW I posted that opinion while he was a player for Siena and a number of others on here disagreed with me.

[hoopjunkie]

Jan 29, 2024 20:58:58 GMT -5 hoopdad said:

IMO, Kyle Young was another D2 caliber player recruited by Carm. I believe his stats at Flagler (which are down this season) prove that. BTW I posted that opinion while he was a player for Siena and a number of others on here disagreed with me.

Kyle was Flagers leading rebounder and 3rd leading scorer last year. This year I have no idea what happened. It looks like he splits time in the middle with another kid who he scores more than and outrebounds in less minutes.

Id take Kyle over Gribben, Frazier, Coyle and Iceman in a heartbeat. He was an enforcer. Every team needs a physical force like him. Kid played hard, maybe too hard, but Id rather a bunch of kids that cared like he did.