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Post by greengold4ever on Mar 21, 2016 9:04:38 GMT -5
not going to get into the argument/comparison................but even at that, Rob Lanier had been to an NCAA and an NIT in his 4 yrs at Siena .............circumstances or not, Patsos brings a lot more to the table than him, so the expectations should be greater on Jimmy, fair or not..................NEXT year (especially with senior laden team & talent), he must to get to NCAA or NIT or we need to go in another direction!!!!!!!!!!
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Post by MTS on Mar 21, 2016 12:02:43 GMT -5
not going to get into the argument/comparison................but even at that, Rob Lanier had been to an NCAA and an NIT in his 4 yrs at Siena .............circumstances or not, Patsos brings a lot more to the table than him, so the expectations should be greater on Jimmy, fair or not..................NEXT year (especially with senior laden team & talent), he must to get to NCAA or NIT or we need to go in another direction!!!!!!!!!! This is kind of how I look at it as well. Next year Siena needs to either win the regular season or postseason championship (hopefully both). If we finish second and lose in the tournament it will be very disappointing. The tournament of course is what you want to win the most but as we've seen it can be a crap shoot so at least win one of them. There are always exceptions we could go 16-4 lose a crazy tiebreaker and lose on a half-court shot in the tournament but what we have coming back in relation to the rest of the league I expect some sort of championship. Only Monmouth is bringing back most of their team other than Siena. Jimmy's not getting fired if he doesn't produce that kind of a season but major questions will persist. I would hold off on any extension before JP wins a championship and then reloads but with a weak AD who knows what he'll do. With three years remaining on JP's contract there is certainly no rush to do anything. Will Brown, for example, was a lame duck a few times before getting extended. Jimmy answered some questions this past season now the question is can he take the next jump? (the biggest one)
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$cott
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Post by $cott on Mar 21, 2016 12:27:16 GMT -5
not going to get into the argument/comparison................but even at that, Rob Lanier had been to an NCAA and an NIT in his 4 yrs at Siena .............circumstances or not, Patsos brings a lot more to the table than him, so the expectations should be greater on Jimmy, fair or not..................NEXT year (especially with senior laden team & talent), he must to get to NCAA or NIT or we need to go in another direction!!!!!!!!!! This is kind of how I look at it as well. Next year Siena needs to either win the regular season or postseason championship (hopefully both). If we finish second and lose in the tournament it will be very disappointing. The tournament of course is what you want to win the most but as we've seen it can be a crap shoot so at least win one of them. There are always exceptions we could go 16-4 lose a crazy tiebreaker and lose on a half-court shot in the tournament but what we have coming back in relation to the rest of the league I expect some sort of championship. Only Monmouth is bringing back most of their team other than Siena. Jimmy's not getting fired if he doesn't produce that kind of a season but major questions will persist. I would hold off on any extension before JP wins a championship and then reloads but with a weak AD who knows what he'll do. With three years remaining on JP's contract there is certainly no rush to do anything. Will Brown, for example, was a lame duck a few times before getting extended. Jimmy answered some questions this past season now the question is can he take the next jump? (the biggest one) I'll settle for no championship if we get an at large bid.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 21, 2016 12:32:34 GMT -5
This is kind of how I look at it as well. Next year Siena needs to either win the regular season or postseason championship (hopefully both). If we finish second and lose in the tournament it will be very disappointing. The tournament of course is what you want to win the most but as we've seen it can be a crap shoot so at least win one of them. There are always exceptions we could go 16-4 lose a crazy tiebreaker and lose on a half-court shot in the tournament but what we have coming back in relation to the rest of the league I expect some sort of championship. Only Monmouth is bringing back most of their team other than Siena. Jimmy's not getting fired if he doesn't produce that kind of a season but major questions will persist. I would hold off on any extension before JP wins a championship and then reloads but with a weak AD who knows what he'll do. With three years remaining on JP's contract there is certainly no rush to do anything. Will Brown, for example, was a lame duck a few times before getting extended. Jimmy answered some questions this past season now the question is can he take the next jump? (the biggest one) I'll settle for no championship if we get an at large bid. I'll settle for beating Iona in the MAAC tourney just once, even if they're the frickin' 12 seed.
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OneIndian
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Post by OneIndian on Mar 21, 2016 13:19:10 GMT -5
Don't hold your breath for an at large out of the MAAC.
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$cott
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Post by $cott on Mar 21, 2016 13:26:15 GMT -5
Don't hold your breath for an at large out of the MAAC. Of course not, and it is even less likely for a team that doesn't win the regular season to get one. Realistically the MAAC would need at least 2 top 50 teams, 4 top 100 teams, and 6 top 150 teams to have any chance at getting two teams in. And no more than two anchors that pull the whole league down. Bad news for the MAAC is that Quinnipiac is in the Advocare which robs the league of potential quality non conference wins. Good news though is Quinnipiac is likely to be one of the bottom teams in the league and the Advocare should at least assure they have a solid non conference SOS.
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Sienafan
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Post by Sienafan on Mar 21, 2016 19:45:36 GMT -5
Fran left Siena six years ago. Why are there still so many posts and discussions about him? It's time to move on already people. Let it go.
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Post by greenblood on Mar 21, 2016 21:18:23 GMT -5
I think this one was started to compare the 3 year anniversary of yet another resurrection of the Siena phoenix from ashes, and the Fran erather was the last one.
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Post by SaintsFan on Mar 23, 2016 6:35:40 GMT -5
Assuming the Hawkeyes do not have a miraculous come back from the 25 point half-time deficit against 'nova, McCaffery' tournament record will be an identical 2-3 at both Siena and Iowa. And arguably more successful at Siena, since he had 3 appearances in 5 seasons vs 3 appearances in 6 seasons at Iowa. Shows that the right coach(es) can compete at the highest levels at Siena. Interesting, Fran a .500 coach (54-50)in his first three years at Iowa taking over a failing program and Patsos is about the same doing the same thing at Siena. Fran is a god and Patsos is a devil to some here. Everything is relative. Let's take the wait and see approach before writing off Patsos. Next year should be a good one with high expectations, recruiting and player development will tell the tale going forward. Fran took over a basketball program at a football school. That program is never the premier program (or even close) in the big 10. Siena on the other hand is all basketball and has many advantages over fellow conference schools. so no... not similar. If he were taking over Loyola, St Peters or Marist they would be better comparisons. Or if Fran took over a struggling Michigan State, Ohio State etc
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Quackman
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Post by Quackman on Mar 23, 2016 7:47:38 GMT -5
Is that the same Iowa program that fired a coach in the off season after making it to the sweet 16?
Try to tell Hawkeye fans that they don't care about basketball.
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skipc
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Post by skipc on Mar 23, 2016 19:46:52 GMT -5
Fran left Siena six years ago. Why are there still so many posts and discussions about him? It's time to move on already people. Let it go. Don't you get it. This is the bar that many on this board will judge every Siena current and future coach on. He will be talked about for the next 20 years. Twenty wins- forget it! 2nd place- forget it! Win the MAAC, then win the tourney or get the hell out!
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OneIndian
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Post by OneIndian on Mar 23, 2016 19:54:35 GMT -5
Fran left Siena six years ago. Why are there still so many posts and discussions about him? It's time to move on already people. Let it go. Don't you get it. This is the bar that many on this board will judge every Siena current and future coach on. He will be talked about for the next 20 years. Twenty wins- forget it! 2nd place- forget it! Win the MAAC, then win the tourney or get the hell out! Yup that's why you play the game, to win. We haven't seen better than 3rd since, a MAAC Tournamnent, a NCAA or Nit bid. You wonder why fans are venting? Winning 20 is nice but if you finish 3rd or 4th and can't win the tournament all It means you're "C" bound. The MAACs a one hit wonder. What's wrong with gunning for the NCAA or NIT. No reason Siena shouldn't be in contention. I don't think anyone expects it every year but a 6 yr lull? Why do you think the players play and the coaches coach? They play to win. Yup, Fran happens to be this programs benchmark and he's a darn good one. I would hope that every coach that comes here wants to achieve what he did, if not you called it right, get the hell out.
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glen
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Post by glen on Mar 24, 2016 7:03:29 GMT -5
Keep in mind even Mike Deane never won the MAAC tourney...or even got to the finals. Even though it has been 6 years for the fans, it has only been 3 years with JP. We can't hold Mitch against him. If anything he's done a reasonable job getting us back on our feet. Sure Fran did it faster but as long as we keep moving forward I'm happy. Next year we just need to catch a break and not have any critical people go down. Be honest...if Fran lost Ronald for 10 games during any of his 3 stellar years - especially in late Jan/February - we wouldn't be talking about how great he was.
I do have concerns about the unbalanced classes and losing Quis/Bisping/JO all at once but that's a year and a half out. Hopefully it is a problem Jimmy can rectify on his way to a first round NCAA win :-)
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musicman
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Post by musicman on Mar 24, 2016 16:36:32 GMT -5
Keep in mind even Mike Deane never won the MAAC tourney...or even got to the finals. Even though it has been 6 years for the fans, it has only been 3 years with JP. We can't hold Mitch against him. If anything he's done a reasonable job getting us back on our feet. Sure Fran did it faster but as long as we keep moving forward I'm happy. Next year we just need to catch a break and not have any critical people go down. Be honest...if Fran lost Ronald for 10 games during any of his 3 stellar years - especially in late Jan/February - we wouldn't be talking about how great he was. I do have concerns about the unbalanced classes and losing Quis/Bisping/JO all at once but that's a year and a half out. Hopefully it is a problem Jimmy can rectify on his way to a first round NCAA win :-) You got it. Win and they will come!
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OneIndian
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Post by OneIndian on Mar 24, 2016 18:20:15 GMT -5
Keep in mind even Mike Deane never won the MAAC tourney...or even got to the finals. Even though it has been 6 years for the fans, it has only been 3 years with JP. We can't hold Mitch against him. If anything he's done a reasonable job getting us back on our feet. Sure Fran did it faster but as long as we keep moving forward I'm happy. Next year we just need to catch a break and not have any critical people go down. Be honest...if Fran lost Ronald for 10 games during any of his 3 stellar years - especially in late Jan/February - we wouldn't be talking about how great he was. I do have concerns about the unbalanced classes and losing Quis/Bisping/JO all at once but that's a year and a half out. Hopefully it is a problem Jimmy can rectify on his way to a first round NCAA win :-) Glen lets back the bus up a bit huh, Mike was almost a 690/750 coach at Siena holding victories over such programs as Pitt Stanford Georgia Tech Kansas St. He recruited some very good players remember Brown and Bennerman Walker Etc.... He did get the Marquette job based on his accomplishments at Siena did he not? Also, I don't play the what if game because you could also say what if Fran had stayed. With Basabe OD Poole Jackson RyRo etc .. and whoever else he would have brought in, we were in pretty good shape to dominate the MAAC for who knows how long. Hell we might even have been in the A10 by now and might have been the next Butler or Xavier. See how the what if game works! Look JPs got a lot to prove. He's had a decent year 1, disastrous year 2 and good year 3. His recruiting to date at Siena has been a mixed bag with some real head scratchers and 2 great players in Wright and Nico. Jury's out on him, he's a 500 MAAC coach with a bunch of footnotes and qualifiers. I said it numerous times, next year big things are expected with a senior dominated team and 3 new guys in Smithen Joseph and Richard. Under perform and the natives will get restless, a lot of pressure next year. Even more pressure to replace the 3 or 4 guys who will be gone the following year. Here's the key, this time around Patsos has the ability to sell a bunch of quality playing time to recruits, kids want to play. There's no reason to under recruit under those circumstances. Patsos has the opportunity to sell some good players if done right. Who he brings in will probably dictate if he will be successful. Bring in the right guys and win he's set, he's golden, he's the man but recruit badly and stay 500 he and Siena are in big trouble. Simple as that ..... Not trying to bash Patsos, right now he's done an ok job but he still has a lot prove. He needs to show he can be more than a 500 guy at Siena.
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