|
|
Post by billmurray on Mar 20, 2016 16:54:17 GMT -5
Past performance. First three years at Siena Fran has 6 more wins and an NCAA bid and win with no serious injuries on his team. The first three years of Patsos' Siena run he lost Bisping for almost a full season and Wright for 15 games and had Wright play less than full strength down the stretch of this season and six wins separate them. Two a year. The championship is a big factor in the separation, I get your point. That recruited group was the greatest in Siena history. Congrats to Fran and the team. I would love for the three year run of the Big Four to be repeated and be the norm, but I don't expect it will happen often and it shouldn't be the expected standard for all subsequent coaches. Again, history is six wins difference in three years. Without injuries Patsos probably has more wins over three years, but I doubt there would have been an NCAA win. So you have me there. Relax and wait and see if there are a series of 20+ wins seasons and some NCAA and NIT bids and wins. Bill by year three Fran had finished 1st, won the MAAC tournament and made it to the second round of the NCAA. Something that Patsos can't claim in 12 years. My point is JP has had amble time in the MAAC to excel but still remains a 500 coach. What leads you to believe this is going to change (serious question)? You can spin it anyway you like but he really doesn't compare to Fran as far as the MAAC goes. Next years recruits are crucial, if he fails he's as good as out. IMO fans are not going to tolerate another 2 yr + rebuild. Siena can't afford it. If he recruits a few impact guys to go along with Nico it'll be a different story. Only time will tell.... OI, you get an A for reading comprehension. That is what I said. |
|
|
|
Post by billmurray on Mar 20, 2016 17:11:23 GMT -5
Past performance. First three years at Siena Fran has 6 more wins and an NCAA bid and win with no serious injuries on his team. The first three years of Patsos' Siena run he lost Bisping for almost a full season and Wright for 15 games and had Wright play less than full strength down the stretch of this season and six wins separate them. Two a year. The championship is a big factor in the separation, I get your point. That recruited group was the greatest in Siena history. Congrats to Fran and the team. I would love for the three year run of the Big Four to be repeated and be the norm, but I don't expect it will happen often and it shouldn't be the expected standard for all subsequent coaches. Again, history is six wins difference in three years. Without injuries Patsos probably has more wins over three years, but I doubt there would have been an NCAA win. So you have me there. Relax and wait and see if there are a series of 20+ wins seasons and some NCAA and NIT bids and wins. To be fair Bill you're right six wins but Fran was 58-36 (.617) to Jimmy's 52-51 (.505) - first year was pretty similar and third year was close (except in the postseason). The big difference was JP's second year was a really bad one some it bad luck and some bad decisions. Injuries are part of game but Wright going down was a killer. Sure it gave Nico more time to develop but who knows how this season would have ended up had he not gotten hurt. At least the team did not fall apart like they did the previous year was Brett got hurt. Year 2 had Bisping out for the majority of the season, Poole and Long out or playing hobbled for a good stretch of the season. It is conceivable that Siena has 8-9 more wins without injuries. We will never know. Nine more wins and it is .617 to .592. Still no NCAA bid and win, but no one said Patsos will be the greatest coach in Siena history. Comparing Loyola to Siena is not a fair comparison. Who won consistently at Loyola. It is a tough place to win. Again, let's wait and see if Patsos can get it done at Siena. This year was a success especially given the injury to Wright. Next year is critical and recruiting next year will tell the tale. That is all I am saying and that is not unreasonable given that Patsos isn't going anywhere next year anyway. My position is we might as well look at the glass half full than empty and circling the drain. My suggestion to MP and some others is to mute the TV and radio and don't read the transcript of Patsos' "dialogues"/monologues. That way only the results on the court will come into play. ;-) |
|
|
|
Post by greenblood on Mar 20, 2016 17:57:29 GMT -5
Basketball programs take time rebuild! Especially when they have to wait for less talented kids to gradate or transfer out! But some fans have no patience! We're waiting now? You are so freaking insulting it's not funny. Those less talented kids you are referring to are JO,Bisping, Oliver and Silas. DEFENSIVE pOY, Bisping is first team all MAAC. I dare you to deny that several games were a on not only with Oliver's shooting but with him calmly running the point. Imoh can't block shots from the frigging bench, oh wait, I myself heard our illustrious coaches wife at Marist while she was sitting behind me say ' we must be desperate, Imoh is in'. SO YEAH LET'S GIVE JP a frigging humanitarian award for letting Imoh graduate. He had no choice but to not run off Imoh. Fr. KeVin made a promise to Imoh when he came here that he would have whatever time he needed here to EARN his degree. DON'T YOU dare say he isn't going to run off his own recruits because anyone with shit for brains can look up the track record at Loyola and can pretty much better on who will be leaving here. |
|
bigsaintg
Associate Head Coach
Posts: 7,047
Dislikes:
|
Post by bigsaintg on Mar 20, 2016 18:13:37 GMT -5
White
Wolfe
Cole
Paige?
Kinnon?
|
|
|
|
Post by greenblood on Mar 20, 2016 18:17:06 GMT -5
+ possibly an assistant, who hasn't brought an effective recruit in....hmmmm
|
|
|
|
Post by billmurray on Mar 20, 2016 18:21:33 GMT -5
+ possibly an assistant, who hasn't brought an effective recruit in....hmmmm But BigSaintG says H. Wright is a lock. :-) |
|
bigsaintg
Associate Head Coach
Posts: 7,047
Dislikes:
|
Post by bigsaintg on Mar 20, 2016 18:46:15 GMT -5
+ possibly an assistant, who hasn't brought an effective recruit in....hmmmm I forgot Luke and Garrett, I forgot to check his grades, Kelly |
|
sky
Junior
Posts: 1,052
Dislikes:
|
Post by sky on Mar 20, 2016 19:44:36 GMT -5
White Wolfe Cole Paige? Kinnon? If Kinnon is run off Tony will probably ban me because I will be such an anti JP poster. |
|
|
|
Post by phillyfan on Mar 20, 2016 19:53:42 GMT -5
I'm really surprised at the turn this post has taken..if anything, I thought it was critical of Frans performance at Iowa vs what he did at Siena..elite conference now, higher seed in the ncaa and yet his ncaa tournament record is the same as it was at Siena ..v interesting I think. And does not anyone remember calling him 500 Fran after his record at Greenville? And who really thinks Mitch B would have gotten as much out of JO, Brett and Oliver as Jimmy did.. The best is yet to come and it won't be in the MAAC...
|
|
OneIndian
Associate Head Coach
Posts: 10,705
Dislikes:
|
Post by OneIndian on Mar 20, 2016 20:12:57 GMT -5
I'm really surprised at the turn this post has taken..if anything, I thought it was critical of Frans performance at Iowa vs what he did at Siena..elite conference now, higher seed in the ncaa and yet his ncaa tournament record is the same as it was at Siena ..v interesting I think. And does not anyone remember calling him 500 Fran after his record at Greenville? And who really thinks Mitch B would have gotten as much out of JO, Brett and Oliver as Jimmy did.. The best is yet to come and it won't be in the MAAC... Really do tell, where is it gonna be and with who? |
|
gorvy
Associate Head Coach
Posts: 10,022
Dislikes:
|
Post by gorvy on Mar 20, 2016 20:13:02 GMT -5
White Wolfe Cole Paige? Kinnon? If Kinnon is run off Tony will probably ban me because I will be such an anti JP poster. . Although larose played in 29 game and averaged about 6 min per game, the last four games he played a total of 6 min inc a dnp in the cbi. |
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
Dislikes:
|
Post by Deleted on Mar 20, 2016 22:08:12 GMT -5
Jimmy likes to hear the sound of his voice too much and he needs to surround himself with people who understand the Siena vision. He is not a gym rat who lives for the game. Maybe he will find clarity in France this spring I hope he doesn't look for clarity in the claret! |
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
Dislikes:
|
Post by Deleted on Mar 20, 2016 22:11:59 GMT -5
To be fair Bill you're right six wins but Fran was 58-36 (.617) to Jimmy's 52-51 (.505) - first year was pretty similar and third year was close (except in the postseason). The big difference was JP's second year was a really bad one some it bad luck and some bad decisions. Injuries are part of game but Wright going down was a killer. Sure it gave Nico more time to develop but who knows how this season would have ended up had he not gotten hurt. At least the team did not fall apart like they did the previous year was Brett got hurt. Year 2 had Bisping out for the majority of the season, Poole and Long out or playing hobbled for a good stretch of the season. It is conceivable that Siena has 8-9 more wins without injuries. We will never know. Nine more wins and it is .617 to .592. Still no NCAA bid and win, but no one said Patsos will be the greatest coach in Siena history. Comparing Loyola to Siena is not a fair comparison. Who won consistently at Loyola. It is a tough place to win. Again, let's wait and see if Patsos can get it done at Siena. This year was a success especially given the injury to Wright. Next year is critical and recruiting next year will tell the tale. That is all I am saying and that is not unreasonable given that Patsos isn't going anywhere next year anyway. My position is we might as well look at the glass half full than empty and circling the drain. My suggestion to MP and some others is to mute the TV and radio and don't read the transcript of Patsos' "dialogues"/monologues. That way only the results on the court will come into play. ;-) Halfway there already and have been since year 1 - never ever listen to him on the radio and tv - not only is it embarrassing, but a waste of time - he never says anything of any value about the game (at least that's what my friends tell me)! |
|
olddave
Team Captain
Posts: 2,665 
Dislikes:
|
Post by olddave on Mar 21, 2016 6:06:46 GMT -5
Year 2 had Bisping out for the majority of the season, Poole and Long out or playing hobbled for a good stretch of the season. It is conceivable that Siena has 8-9 more wins without injuries. We will never know. Nine more wins and it is .617 to .592. Still no NCAA bid and win, but no one said Patsos will be the greatest coach in Siena history. Comparing Loyola to Siena is not a fair comparison. Who won consistently at Loyola. It is a tough place to win. Again, let's wait and see if Patsos can get it done at Siena. This year was a success especially given the injury to Wright. Next year is critical and recruiting next year will tell the tale. That is all I am saying and that is not unreasonable given that Patsos isn't going anywhere next year anyway. My position is we might as well look at the glass half full than empty and circling the drain. My suggestion to MP and some others is to mute the TV and radio and don't read the transcript of Patsos' "dialogues"/monologues. That way only the results on the court will come into play. ;-) Halfway there already and have been since year 1 - never ever listen to him on the radio and tv - not only is it embarrassing, but a waste of time - he never says anything of any value about the game (at least that's what my friends tell me)! In regards to thru pressers MP is correct. While pressers are a small percentage of coaching duties, it is not good for the school to, have commentators ie. Huerter Jacques stating with a smile that the presser was normal JP. JP needs to continue to developed regarding that aspect of his skills. |
|
glen
Team Captain
Posts: 1,851
Dislikes:
|
Post by glen on Mar 21, 2016 7:20:00 GMT -5
So far, JP has been successful. The degree of success can be argued but he's definitely gotten the program back to winning. Year 2 looks to be an anomaly. Next year looks to be solid. We'll miss the seniors but their numbers are replaceable.
IMO, the test for JP will be in 2 years after Quis, JO and Bisping all graduate. That will be a sh*t ton of stats, experience and minutes to replace. I don't see WB and Fisher filling the front court holes (yet) but there is hope for the back court. Either way, at least we're talking about degrees of success instead of who was worse (Mitch/Beyer/Lanier).
Personally, I'm optimistic. Nico is a blue chipper. At 6'4" - Kenny can be a tough PG to cover. Fisher was developing and with some experience and strength Kinnon could be the outside threat we need. I'm not sure what next year's frosh bring but if there's even 1 impact player we are looking OK. We *should* be in the hunt for a title.
|
|
