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Post by Deleted on Dec 27, 2017 13:44:58 GMT -5
Patsos will love him. He doesnt make mistakes, is a better passer than Horn, shoots the damn lights out. He comes in immediately game-ready, Patsos called him the combo of Downey and Rob Poole. At 6-4 he can fit in to these 4 guard looks I would think. HJ mentioned earlier that we need guys who just want to shoot the ball when guys like Welch and Nico drive and kick.... well Wojcik is your guy for that, and I think he’d absolutely thrive. I agree that we start to run into a logjam, but I could see Horn going into Khalil’s role and Wojcik taking Horn’s. Guards will be leaving I have to imagine. Downey was one of the worst volume 3 point shooters Siena has ever had. If this kid shoots anything like Downey and he's slower than Horn as KK thinks then we are in big trouble! Wojcik wasn't even the PG on his HS team. In film he's mostly a set shooter with a few crafty moves to get himself open on overplays. He's not a PG and I'm not sure he's even a combo guard. Guys who can back up Penn will get time over those who can't. That will be a need. Right now, Horn is the only guy on this team who can grow into a decent backup PG. He's also the only other guy on this team who has ever been the primary full time PG for a HS team. He's not a guy you leave on an island like Moore or Wright but neither were Wormley or Oliver. Horn is the best chance for someone to grow into that caretaker backup point guard...whether some like it or not. Horn is way ahead of Oliver's career track already.
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Post by goldsaint17 on Dec 27, 2017 13:45:50 GMT -5
Patsos will love him. He doesnt make mistakes, is a better passer than Horn, shoots the damn lights out. He comes in immediately game-ready, Patsos called him the combo of Downey and Rob Poole. At 6-4 he can fit in to these 4 guard looks I would think. HJ mentioned earlier that we need guys who just want to shoot the ball when guys like Welch and Nico drive and kick.... well Wojcik is your guy for that, and I think he’d absolutely thrive. I agree that we start to run into a logjam, but I could see Horn going into Khalil’s role and Wojcik taking Horn’s. Guards will be leaving I have to imagine. How do you know he's a better passer? How do you know he's game ready? Cause he's played D1 already? He seems awkward and slow off the bounce in film. He may grow to be Kyle Downey crafty and tough but Kyle Downey had a career negative assist ratio and didn't learn to rebound until he was a senior. I think Horn could be a better rebounder as well. Richard shoots the lights out just as much and is quicker and a more explosive scorer. Horn, long term, could settle in as the tougher, more solid guy that Ryan Oliver was. Wojcik feels like LaRose to me. Upside may be as a Brian Bernardi but I don't know that Jimmy will give him the chance to develop that far if they get 2 more big athletic wings. Richard, if he plays wild, could lose out as Wojcik is bigger and neither will likely defend well. But it'd be a frosh beating out a junior 40% shooter. I think Horn is going to make his case with his assist ratio, shooting, and rebounding the rest of this year...that he can be a solid bench guard. But that's just my opinion. I see Horn as the new Oliver. I think Wojcik is better in catch-and-shoot than Richard. He’s got all the craftiness, and his film (albeit some from highlight tapes) showed some very slick passes off drive and kick action as well as cuts. His handle needs to tighten a bit, but he plays at a really good high school and always looks super composed on film. I personally see him as more of a Rob Poole/Shane Richards combo without some of that rebounding. But, they are freshmen and we’ll see.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 27, 2017 13:53:29 GMT -5
How do you know he's a better passer? How do you know he's game ready? Cause he's played D1 already? He seems awkward and slow off the bounce in film. He may grow to be Kyle Downey crafty and tough but Kyle Downey had a career negative assist ratio and didn't learn to rebound until he was a senior. I think Horn could be a better rebounder as well. Richard shoots the lights out just as much and is quicker and a more explosive scorer. Horn, long term, could settle in as the tougher, more solid guy that Ryan Oliver was. Wojcik feels like LaRose to me. Upside may be as a Brian Bernardi but I don't know that Jimmy will give him the chance to develop that far if they get 2 more big athletic wings. Richard, if he plays wild, could lose out as Wojcik is bigger and neither will likely defend well. But it'd be a frosh beating out a junior 40% shooter. I think Horn is going to make his case with his assist ratio, shooting, and rebounding the rest of this year...that he can be a solid bench guard. But that's just my opinion. I see Horn as the new Oliver. I think Wojcik is better in catch-and-shoot than Richard. He’s got all the craftiness, and his film (albeit some from highlight tapes) showed some very slick passes off drive and kick action as well as cuts. His handle needs to tighten a bit, but he plays at a really good high school and always looks super composed on film. I personally see him as more of a Rob Poole/Shane Richards combo without some of that rebounding. But, they are freshmen and we’ll see. Dude, Richard is a career 42% 3 point shooter at THIS level and in HS. Wojcik has yet to take a shot at this level and we have no statistics regarding what he shot in HS. There's just highlights. The game may end up too fast for him. Wojcik is no more a proven commodity than anyone else...especially when there's no stats to show us his style of play. Fran told us Downey was a great shooter but there were not stats to back it up and he couldn't hit the broad side of barn from behind the arc once he got to D1. I think this kid is probably a knock down shooter as advertised but I question whether he's going to be very good with the ball in his hands and I doubt his defense and energy/quickness to get boards.
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Quackman
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Post by Quackman on Dec 27, 2017 14:11:44 GMT -5
Man, it used to be that fans on these boards threw kids on the scrap heap if they didn't excel from day one as a freshman. Now, fans are doing the same thing to kids before they even get here.
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$cott
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Post by $cott on Dec 27, 2017 14:19:28 GMT -5
Man, it used to be that fans on these boards threw kids on the scrap heap if they didn't excel from day one as a freshman. Now, fans are doing the same thing to kids before they even get here. I actually think it is the opposite, every year there are people putting waaaaay too high expectations on freshman that it makes it very difficult for them to live up to those expectations.
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OneIndian
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Post by OneIndian on Dec 27, 2017 14:27:42 GMT -5
It amazes me how people, not just on this board, take a tiny sample size of a 16-17 year old and make blanket declarations about their future potential. A year ago Aaron Judge had too many holes in his swing and was not expected to even sniff the Bronx in 2017. Sent from my SM-G935P using proboards Read the board every summer the prognosticators are in full swing. I get a laugh by game two of the OOC schedule it’s all out the window.
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Quackman
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Post by Quackman on Dec 27, 2017 15:48:50 GMT -5
It amazes me how people, not just on this board, take a tiny sample size of a 16-17 year old and make blanket declarations about their future potential. A year ago Aaron Judge had too many holes in his swing and was not expected to even sniff the Bronx in 2017. Sent from my SM-G935P using proboards Read the board every summer the prognosticators are in full swing. I get a laugh by game two of the OOC schedule it’s all out the window. Yup, and that's why I don't follow recruiting all that much. PPC was absolutely correct when she talked about player development. Yes, you need good recruits but you also need kids that are going to get better throughout their stay in Loudonville.
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hoopjunkie
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Post by hoopjunkie on Dec 27, 2017 16:42:44 GMT -5
I still don't see how Jake Wojcik will find time on this team the way it's built. He probably can't play PG. He's not an athletic defender/driver...and he's on a team filled with guys who can shoot..which is his primary strength. On top of those disadvantages he'll be a frosh. If Kinnon LaRose couldn't get time with less guard depth, it could be harder for Wojcik. He may be able to shoot the lights out but, the team will likely be playing with 4 guards who can shoot at all times even without him. Horn seems, to me, to have more all around skills in the long term and looks quicker. And he'll have the advantage of being an experienced sophomore with more ability to back up the PG for short stretches like Oliver did as he matured. Jake will be Penns back up at the point. He can handle the ball much better than Kinnon so he ll have a role immediately next year.
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Post by hoopjunkie on Dec 27, 2017 16:46:40 GMT -5
if these guys could play they would have other offers. Who are “these guys”? Jake Wojcik? He committed before his junior year! He won player of the year in his conference (a good one) and was first team all Nor-Cal by MaxPreps. Several national recruiting analysts have said we got a good one. Patsos went out with Manning and spent a week with him this summer to keep his commitment. Tariq Johnson has Wagner and James Madison. Dom Welch has St. Bonnie’s, UMass, Cleveland State, Hofstra, Buffalo. Wilson had commitable offers from Boston U and NJIT but left them on the table to bet on himself because he grew an inch and a half, so he’s the only slightly concerning one, but his tape is very good and he has the numbers to back them up from prep. Don't worry about SF. He' ll never be happy, or right. The guys we are taking about all have offers. He's just mad they're not from Lake George.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 27, 2017 17:14:54 GMT -5
I still don't see how Jake Wojcik will find time on this team the way it's built. He probably can't play PG. He's not an athletic defender/driver...and he's on a team filled with guys who can shoot..which is his primary strength. On top of those disadvantages he'll be a frosh. If Kinnon LaRose couldn't get time with less guard depth, it could be harder for Wojcik. He may be able to shoot the lights out but, the team will likely be playing with 4 guards who can shoot at all times even without him. Horn seems, to me, to have more all around skills in the long term and looks quicker. And he'll have the advantage of being an experienced sophomore with more ability to back up the PG for short stretches like Oliver did as he matured. Jake will be Penns back up at the point. He can handle the ball much better than Kinnon so he ll have a role immediately next year. Oh, well if you say so it must be true.
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bison137
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Post by bison137 on Dec 27, 2017 18:47:23 GMT -5
He's got athleticism but without any stats or good offers or anything...he's a wild card. I don't quite like his movements in highlights to be a 1-3 guard as much as Johnson though maybe he's more capable of playing the PF than he his. Maybe he's more like a Marvin Prochet. He's officially listed at 6-6 at South Plains..and that's a bit bigger than the others. He could be better for that position than what we have now. If he's coming, I bet we find out fast as he smells like a mid year transfer to me. If he's got good grades, he's not playing, and it's not the coach that recruited him...I don't know what would be keeping him at JUCO. I don't think Siena currently has an open scholarship to give the kid mid year. If he comes, it will either be this summer or on his own dime. A mid-year transfer from a JUCO is not eligible to play until the following season.
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Post by sienafanallyearlong2 on Dec 27, 2017 19:41:33 GMT -5
So did we get the kid or not?
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Post by Tony on Dec 28, 2017 5:59:38 GMT -5
Wow- more threads all over the place. Haters and “fluffers” out in full force
Current recruits- yes JP has a few nice recruits on the “line” can he land them? His track record is not good in competitive situations, so I would say doubtful, he usually drops down to his plan b or sometimes plan C or D recruits. But to say his current recruits have no offers is non informed
Wojcik- not concerned about his offerhe looks slow, I’ll withhold judgement till he gets here. To be claiming he will take Richards role before kid even gets here is talking like a JP fluffer
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Post by SaintsFan on Dec 28, 2017 9:45:42 GMT -5
Who are “these guys”? Jake Wojcik? He committed before his junior year! He won player of the year in his conference (a good one) and was first team all Nor-Cal by MaxPreps. Several national recruiting analysts have said we got a good one. Patsos went out with Manning and spent a week with him this summer to keep his commitment. Tariq Johnson has Wagner and James Madison. Dom Welch has St. Bonnie’s, UMass, Cleveland State, Hofstra, Buffalo. Wilson had commitable offers from Boston U and NJIT but left them on the table to bet on himself because he grew an inch and a half, so he’s the only slightly concerning one, but his tape is very good and he has the numbers to back them up from prep. Don't worry about SF. He' ll never be happy, or right. The guys we are taking about all have offers. He's just mad they're not from Lake George. Patsos will not land Welch and probably not land Johnson. I was speaking to Christian Wilson etc. The players in which there is true competition for... will not be here so that argument is moot. Wilson has offers from BU (mid pack patriot league) and NJIT ... well NJIT is NJIT. Enough said.
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Post by SaintsFan on Dec 28, 2017 9:50:56 GMT -5
Wow- more threads all over the place. Haters and “fluffers” out in full force Current recruits- yes JP has a few nice recruits on the “line” can he land them? His track record is not good in competitive situations, so I would say doubtful, he usually drops down to his plan b or sometimes plan C or D recruits. But to say his current recruits have no offers is non informed Wojcik- not concerned about his offers he was early commit. How many offers did Rob Poole have? My main concern about Wojcik is his speed, to be truthful is looks slow, I’ll withhold judgement till he gets here. To be claiming he will take Richards role before kid even gets here is talking like a JP fluffer What was Rob Poole's ranking. Poole like others McCaffery recruited, was in that sweet spot of 200-500. The recruits we have seen under this administration are in the 700+ - unknown range.
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