Sienafan
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Post by Sienafan on Sept 13, 2016 18:09:17 GMT -5
Where did anyone say they expected a class full of impact players? I think most board members were thinking two and a solid role player Read all the posts on the topic. The general feeling is this class needs to replace what will be lost after this season.
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OneIndian
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Post by OneIndian on Sept 13, 2016 18:14:03 GMT -5
Where did anyone say they expected a class full of impact players? I think most board members were thinking two and a solid role player Read all the posts on the topic. The general feeling is this class needs to replace what will be lost after this season. At least 2 need to be solid you're losing 4 starters you should be able to get at least 2 quality kids
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Post by Tony on Sept 13, 2016 18:48:53 GMT -5
Jimmy could win the MAAC this year and sign 2 or 3 solid player( not studs) but solid mid major type players and not role players.. he really is in control of his own destiny. He has at least 2 years to prove himself
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Post by siena12077 on Sept 13, 2016 19:44:21 GMT -5
Post season bid and he might be looking to push for another extension in a year or two to keep the money rolling in
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Post by Tony on Sept 14, 2016 4:28:57 GMT -5
Post season bid and he might be looking to push for another extension in a year or two to keep the money rolling in Just my opinion, but unless Jimmy goes to a post season tournament that starts with an N- I don’t see any guaranteed contract extension. A tournament that starts with a C won’t get it done. If he wins the MAAC – a guaranteed contract extension will be in order for sure!
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 14, 2016 6:24:25 GMT -5
JP is likely about to win 20 for the 5th time in 6 years. That's not something you get fired for.
Yeah, the recruiting and finishes haven't quite been what we want them to be but no other school in the MAAC would fire him for this.
I think as long as he keeps putting up winning records he'll be our coach. And other coaches make more than him. It's not like he's getting paid a premium.
Cluess, Sydney, and Moore all make more than he does, I believe.
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bigsaintg
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Post by bigsaintg on Sept 14, 2016 6:41:57 GMT -5
JP is likely about to win 20 for the 5th time in 6 years. That's not something you get fired for. Yeah, the recruiting and finishes haven't quite been what we want them to be but no other school in the MAAC would fire him for this. I think as long as he keeps putting up winning records he'll be our coach. And other coaches make more than him. It's not like he's getting paid a premium. Cluess, Sydney, and Moore all make more than he does, I believe. I basically agre but two things: 1. But if they make more than him is anyone else offering him more to leave Siena? No 2. With Jimmy it's the intangibles that rub many alum the wrong way. How he conducts himself in post game press conferences and in other venues. It's acceptable as long as you win
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nolesaint
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Post by nolesaint on Sept 14, 2016 6:57:12 GMT -5
Tony - spot on Sky - you're almost half right. The other players signed each year must be at least MM role players, no LM or D2 players and the majority need to be here all four years. Sienafan - what??? You're now falling into the BM school of twisting people's words... BSG - spot on
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nolesaint
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Post by nolesaint on Sept 14, 2016 7:00:37 GMT -5
Post season bid and he might be looking to push for another extension in a year or two to keep the money rolling in Just my opinion, but unless Jimmy goes to a post season tournament that starts with an N- I don’t see any guaranteed contract extension. A tournament that starts with a C won’t get it done. If he wins the MAAC – a guaranteed contract extension will be in order for sure! Don't agree completely with this - win the MAAC but without having "compete for the MAAC title every year" talent on campus already and committed for '17 and he shouldn't get any extension of the guarantee. That is unless Siena's long time stated goal for the program has changed....
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OneIndian
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Post by OneIndian on Sept 14, 2016 7:57:06 GMT -5
This is JPs 4th year this is his team, he's recruited everyone on the roster but JO and Brett (Mitch's kids), if he can't get it done with the talent level this year what makes anyone think that he ever will? He's had 12 years in the MAAC with no first place finishes and one NCAA. The guestion is does Patsos prove he's the guy by getting Siena to a "N" tournament or is he just destine to be a lifer 500 guy.
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sky
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Post by sky on Sept 14, 2016 8:12:35 GMT -5
Tony - spot on Sky - you're almost half right. The other players signed each year must be at least MM role players, no LM or D2 players and the majority need to be here all four years. Sienafan - what??? You're now falling into the BM school of twisting people's words... BSG - spot on Noelsaint...you are right on your assesment of my post...I never mentioned other recruits...the point I was trying to make was that if we can work toward an impact player each year the 4th year we would have an extremely strong team. That in itself would be an attraction to potential high caliber recruits...
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 14, 2016 8:18:35 GMT -5
This is JPs 4th year this is his team, he's recruited everyone on the roster but JO and Brett (Mitch's kids), if he can't get it done with the talent level this year what makes anyone think that he ever will? He's had 12 years in the MAAC with no first place finishes and one NCAA. The guestion is does Patsos prove he's the guy by getting Siena to a "N" tournament or is he just destine to be a lifer 500 guy. For Siena he's at 52-51. He'll probably end the year around 74-61. Last 5 years, he's 99-72 and that could be around 121-82 after this year. That's 59.6 winning %. He's only 51.4% overall but building up Loyola those first 7 years was no easy task so I really only judge him based on when he started to get a name for himself. Over these last 5 years, only Cluess has won more MAAC games. That's it. Not even Masiello has won more than 99 (92-71). You get rid of Patsos, you're essentially firing the #2 coach in the league win wise over this span. I, for one, see a coach who is continuously learning from his mistakes. He seems to be getting better and understands where he needs to improve. That's a good thing. He's not perfect and he needs to find a way to reach the peak, but it's not like he's regressing as a coach. If he was, I'd feel differently. He's a bit of goofball but so what, it makes it more entertaining. Are you not entertained?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 14, 2016 8:55:43 GMT -5
He's managed to keep teams competitive even without depth of elite talent so even if there's a drop off next year, it may not be horrible. A year in 6th or 7th followed by another up year isn't horrible if that's how it plays out.
But it may not even be that bad.
Monmouth loses everyone you know except Seaborn. Robinson, Hornbeak, Stewart, Brady, Tillman, James and even bench mobber Noack...and perhaps even Rice...all gone. SPU loses Wyche, Welton, Patterson, and Griffin after this year. Marist loses Hart. Rider loses Thomas n' Taylor and Lundy. (their only 3 proven commodities as of now) CC loses Valenti Iona loses Severe, Cassell, Washington & Bessick Manhattan loses Wilson and Williams Quinny loses Donovan Smith and Harris.
Iona, FF, and perhaps Manhattan may still be strong but nobody else is a guarantee to be out of the PIG at this point. JP could perhaps pull out a top 5 finish somehow if he found decent PG play.
JP can find a way maybe even with what he has now. Smithen, Richard, Clareth, WB, Friday with Shivers, Heurter, Fisher, Degnan may not be that sexy right now but, if things break right, it might be enough for, say, 5th in next years' possibly down MAAC. I mean, there are some tools there.
That's not bad for a down year.
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OneIndian
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Post by OneIndian on Sept 14, 2016 9:09:53 GMT -5
👆👆👆👆👆👆
Yeah yeah yeah you can spin stuff 6 ways from Sunday working numbers but the fact remains ....
after 12 years he's 500 has never finished 1st and has only 1 NCAA appearance. That's a pretty good sampling. You're a numbers guy, averages tend to trend for a reason. So yes he should definitely go over 500 this year BUT the million dollar question is, is he back to 500 next year or the year after. That's how and why a 500 guy is what he is .... He goes up and down but eventually always hits his mark.
Again I'm not suggesting it's one or the other just asking the question IS Jimmy going to prove himself as something different or is he the 500 coach history has shown to date.
The longer we go being irrelevant, the more fans fall off and it's one more nail in the box that is/was Siena's basketball program.
Let's hope he trends up the next 3 years this program can't take the fall off or mediocrity after the Mitch debacle.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 14, 2016 9:34:37 GMT -5
My point is that the MAAC, in general, is trending down a bit and Patsos is, for the most part, out pacing a lot of his competition by staying the same and even improving some. Much of the MAAC is recruiting worse than we are.
Would you throw away a guy who has you in the hunt most years and seems like he's still learning but just needs to find a way to turn the corner and start all over?
FF may be the 2nd best team in the league next year and they are led by Segura. A mini PG who can't shoot.
You could start a backcourt of 6-3 Smithen and 6-0 Richard and they can compete with most MAAC teams if they take care of the ball and put up some points. Half the MAAC teams can't even find a real PG nowadays. If Smithen can manage the game and Richard puts up Kidani Brutus type numbers, you're almost already top 5. Those 2 and Clareth could probably take care of the ball enough to keep us in most games. Half the MAAC doesn't even really have a real PF either so a guy like WB already has been to date, is almost a plus there.
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