The Right Backed Another Winner

[SaintsFan]

"Go to a flat tax, which again is being recommended and promoted by the republicans, conservatives, and tea party folks."

this comment absolutely wreaks of ignorance. When the system is stacked in your favor youre going to pull for a flat tax. Even more in your pocket and "those deadbeats who make less than me, work so much less than me and are not nearly as worth what I am to society can begin to pull their own weight.

Anyone who can step back and look at the whole situation of our country and the world today and make that statement with a straight face really should be stripped of their right to vote. Ignorance will get you nowhere.

and health insurance should be provided in this country for every single citizen. With the amount of money we pour into it, there is ZERO reason that every single citizen shouldnt have quality health care. The reason it will never happen... all those middle men standing between the care giver and the patient all want their money. They are worse than welfare recipients. or corporate welfare recipients.

[CellarRat]

May 5, 2014 7:24:17 GMT -5 @misspractice said:

May 5, 2014 6:49:15 GMT -5 CellarRat said:

And Obama raised taxes on individuals and especially on small businesses, so who are you blaming. That's what happens when you elect a socialist, you get an anemic economy similar to much of Europe.

Go to a flat tax, which again is being recommended and promoted by the republicans, conservatives, and tea party folks.

More rhetoric by SF regarding taxation. Fair share, and all the other words don't mean anything. Everyone has to have skin in the game and the only way to do that is to have equal taxation. Otherwise you get some voting to increase taxes on others- a system which is not only unfair but not sustainable.

Would you please identify the taxes that our President increased on individuals? Thank you in advance for a factual and not a rhetorical reply.

www.atr.org/full-list-ACA-tax-hikes-a6996

[Deleted]

Thanks. Which ones directly impact you? Thankfully, none impact me.

[CellarRat]

May 5, 2014 14:50:22 GMT -5 @misspractice said:

Thanks. Which ones directly impact you? Thankfully, none impact me.

I'm not surprised none impact you. That's why you are in favor of raising taxes for others. You are an angry fool. Most folks that agree on raising taxes are the same people that are paying less, you made my point again.

[Deleted]

May 5, 2014 16:21:02 GMT -5 CellarRat said:

May 5, 2014 14:50:22 GMT -5 @misspractice said:

Thanks. Which ones directly impact you? Thankfully, none impact me.

I'm not surprised none impact you. That's why you are in favor of raising taxes for others. You are an angry fool. Most folks that agree on raising taxes are the same people that are paying less, you made my point again.

You are hilarious! Show me where I have ever been in favor of raising taxes. What an idiotic statement - I pay way too much as it is and certainly have no desire to increase that chunk of continuing debt. Does calling me an angry fool somehow make you feel better, more important, smart, or is it just a relief valve to let your obvious frustration with life escape? OBTW, most of those "taxes" do not impact "most" individuals. That right wing article is "generous" with its use of "tax" as a descriptor for each item.

[th24]

CNN: Republican’s have big advantage in mid-terms!

politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2014/05/05/cnn-poll-gop-advantage-in-midterms/

[indian82]

May 5, 2014 5:51:37 GMT -5 SaintsFan said:

May 2, 2014 20:05:48 GMT -5 CellarRat said:

Hilarious, so raise taxes even more? The 90s had the internet boom. The economy grew despite the increase in taxes by Clinton, which I believe he later regretted.

Taxes and social programs have increased dramitically under Obama and the economy remains anemic.

Raising taxes doesnt increase productivity and it doesn't decrease poverty. Just to be clear.

A correction. Taxes for business have continued to decline over the past 30 to 40 years further placing the burden on individuals. The economy is at its best when both business and individuals pay their share. Corporate taxes accounted for as much as 45% of government revenue but have since figured out how to evade/avoid so much so that they now account for about 11%. THIS is the only reason government at all levels is strapped and why the middle class is being obliterated.

I would like to see your source about the corp taxes accounting for 45% of govt revenue in the past, but this one seems to show a rate of about 25-30% in about 1950. It jumps a bit briefly in the early 50's but then is on a steady decline until it goes to about 9% in 2010. Individual Income tax seems to have stayed fairly level since 1950. What sticks out here is the steadily growing percentage of payroll taxes.



From:  www.taxpolicycenter.org/briefing-book/background/numbers/revenue.cfm

If I understand the term 'payroll taxes', it mostly refers to the taxes that employers have to pay based strictly upon the number of employees they have (see this link). So while the 'income tax' employers have to pay has gone down, the overall amount that they have to pay to the govt has gone up. So wording is critical.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Payroll_tax

[SaintsFan]

a correction to your Chart stament I82, Payroll Taxes from your own provided link...

"Payroll taxes generally fall into two categories: deductions from an employee’s wages and taxes paid by the employer based on the employee's wages. The first kind are taxes that employers are required to withhold from employees' wages, also known as withholding tax, pay-as-you-earn tax (PAYE), or pay-as-you-go tax (PAYG) and often covering advance payment of income tax, social security contributions, and various insurances (e.g., unemployment and disability)."

this accounts for most of the increase in "Payroll taxes". As stated above... that is coming out of the workers income. NOT the Corporate profits etc. Again... this accounts for the vast majority of that charts increase to "Payroll taxes" and is obviously coming directly out of the workers income.

[indian82]

May 6, 2014 9:18:11 GMT -5 SaintsFan said:

a correction to your Chart stament I82, Payroll Taxes from your own provided link...

"Payroll taxes generally fall into two categories: deductions from an employee’s wages and taxes paid by the employer based on the employee's wages. The first kind are taxes that employers are required to withhold from employees' wages, also known as withholding tax, pay-as-you-earn tax (PAYE), or pay-as-you-go tax (PAYG) and often covering advance payment of income tax, social security contributions, and various insurances (e.g., unemployment and disability)."

this accounts for most of the increase in "Payroll taxes". As stated above... that is coming out of the workers income. NOT the Corporate profits etc. Again... this accounts for the vast majority of that charts increase to "Payroll taxes" and is obviously coming directly out of the workers income.

I disagree that most of the increase is for the worker, because that would be counting Individual Income tax twice in that diagram - the majority of the withholding is already the 'Individual Income tax' segment of the chart (see Part 2 of the description of Payroll tax from the Wiki leak below. Unless the intent is to count it twice (which would be very misleading, as well as inaccurate), the vast majority of the 'Payroll Tax' in this chart would be SS & Medicare tax which is shared equally between employer & employee. This resulted in the Payroll tax starting to mushroom in the 60's with the SS Act of 1965. If I understand correctly, employers pay an UnEmployment tax in the Payroll category, so without much more info, I think it's safe to say that employers & employees pretty much equally share that increasing segment of revenue for the govt.

The second kind is a tax that is paid from the employer's own funds and that is directly related to employing a worker. These can consist of fixed charges or be proportionally linked to an employee's pay. The charges paid by the employer usually cover the employer's funding of the social security system, and other insurance programs.

[Deleted]

May 6, 2014 11:34:40 GMT -5 indian82 said:

May 6, 2014 9:18:11 GMT -5 SaintsFan said:

a correction to your Chart stament I82, Payroll Taxes from your own provided link...

"Payroll taxes generally fall into two categories: deductions from an employee’s wages and taxes paid by the employer based on the employee's wages. The first kind are taxes that employers are required to withhold from employees' wages, also known as withholding tax, pay-as-you-earn tax (PAYE), or pay-as-you-go tax (PAYG) and often covering advance payment of income tax, social security contributions, and various insurances (e.g., unemployment and disability)."

this accounts for most of the increase in "Payroll taxes". As stated above... that is coming out of the workers income. NOT the Corporate profits etc. Again... this accounts for the vast majority of that charts increase to "Payroll taxes" and is obviously coming directly out of the workers income.

I disagree that most of the increase is for the worker, because that would be counting Individual Income tax twice in that diagram - the majority of the withholding is already the 'Individual Income tax' segment of the chart (see Part 2 of the description of Payroll tax from the Wiki leak below. Unless the intent is to count it twice (which would be very misleading, as well as inaccurate), the vast majority of the 'Payroll Tax' in this chart would be SS & Medicare tax which is shared equally between employer & employee. This resulted in the Payroll tax starting to mushroom in the 60's with the SS Act of 1965. If I understand correctly, employers pay an UnEmployment tax in the Payroll category, so without much more info, I think it's safe to say that employers & employees pretty much equally share that increasing segment of revenue for the govt.

The second kind is a tax that is paid from the employer's own funds and that is directly related to employing a worker. These can consist of fixed charges or be proportionally linked to an employee's pay. The charges paid by the employer usually cover the employer's funding of the social security system, and other insurance programs.

There are two components of the income tax revenue stream - that withheld from employee paychecks and paid to the fed by employers and that paid directly by self-employed, retired, and others. The Government Accounting system looks at all of the received income tax as available revenue since the reconciliation of those dollars is not made until the following year and any refunds would appear in the expense portion of that budget. It is not easy to fully understand the basis for the graph's categories (and I for one don't fully trust Wikipedia as a viable source of factual data) but it is not a stretch to see that income tax revenue may be split in the presentation.

[indian82]

But unless I'm missing something, it's all Individual Income Tax (IIT). I am assuming the IIT category is al revenue streams and not just self-employed, retired, etc.

And BTW the chart is not from Wiki, just the explanation of the term Payroll Tax.

[Deleted]

May 6, 2014 15:37:42 GMT -5 indian82 said:

But unless I'm missing something, it's all Individual Income Tax (IIT). I am assuming the IIT category is al revenue streams and not just self-employed, retired, etc.

And BTW the chart is not from Wiki, just the explanation of the term Payroll Tax.

Yes, I know that chart didn't come from Wikipedia. The income taxes paid by corporations include ss and medicare - the ss amount is the same as what each employee pays (if you are self employed, you pay that part as well). Not sure what the medicare share is for employers. Those amounts are directly tied to earned income.