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Post by goldsaint17 on Dec 28, 2017 16:57:12 GMT -5
Debated posting this, but think it’s pretty interesting/important to note. t.co/ICWKR2jnKyThat’s the NCAA’s latest release on transfers in Division 1 basketball. A few poignant facts: -About 40% of all MBB players who enter Division I directly out of high school depart their initial school by the end of their sophomore year. -More then half of D1 teams had at least 2 players transfer after last season. Puts things in perspective when we talk about the “revolving door” that some have complained about here. By the numbers, we are about average in total transfers per year and by the numbers, 2 of the 5 in our current freshman class will be gone by next year. Crazy to think about, and I don’t like these numbers whatsoever. But I think it puts things in a bit more of a reasonable perspective. |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 28, 2017 21:50:28 GMT -5
Debated posting this, but think it’s pretty interesting/important to note. t.co/ICWKR2jnKyThat’s the NCAA’s latest release on transfers in Division 1 basketball. A few poignant facts: -About 40% of all MBB players who enter Division I directly out of high school depart their initial school by the end of their sophomore year. -More then half of D1 teams had at least 2 players transfer after last season. Puts things in perspective when we talk about the “revolving door” that some have complained about here. By the numbers, we are about average in total transfers per year and by the numbers, 2 of the 5 in our current freshman class will be gone by next year. Crazy to think about, and I don’t like these numbers whatsoever. But I think it puts things in a bit more of a reasonable perspective. I would defer to our resident statistical expert, KK, but by my read of your data, we would be running at twice the annual rate if 2 of our 5 freshmen leave in their first year - national stats, per your post, have the 40% gone after two years. Am I missing something? Also, if you look at offers and acceptances JP is hoping for at least 4 departures this year - another data point supporting our numbers at twice the national average of two departures per year. |
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th24
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Post by th24 on Dec 28, 2017 22:44:47 GMT -5
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Post by goldsaint17 on Dec 28, 2017 22:50:22 GMT -5
Debated posting this, but think it’s pretty interesting/important to note. t.co/ICWKR2jnKyThat’s the NCAA’s latest release on transfers in Division 1 basketball. A few poignant facts: -About 40% of all MBB players who enter Division I directly out of high school depart their initial school by the end of their sophomore year. -More then half of D1 teams had at least 2 players transfer after last season. Puts things in perspective when we talk about the “revolving door” that some have complained about here. By the numbers, we are about average in total transfers per year and by the numbers, 2 of the 5 in our current freshman class will be gone by next year. Crazy to think about, and I don’t like these numbers whatsoever. But I think it puts things in a bit more of a reasonable perspective. I would defer to our resident statistical expert, KK, but by my read of your data, we would be running at twice the annual rate if 2 of our 5 freshmen leave in their first year - national stats, per your post, have the 40% gone after two years. Am I missing something? Also, if you look at offers and acceptances JP is hoping for at least 4 departures this year - another data point supporting our numbers at twice the national average of two departures per year. “Will be gone by next year” was saying by the end of their sophomore year, sorry about that if that wasn’t clear. And he’s looking at 3 from what I have told, of which 2 of the more likely candidates discussed on this board will have graduated. |
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OneIndian
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Post by OneIndian on Dec 29, 2017 8:41:48 GMT -5
Transfer willingly v. Run off are entirely different!
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Quackman
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Post by Quackman on Dec 29, 2017 9:15:08 GMT -5
Transfer willingly v. Run off are entirely different! Sure, because the only kids who leave Siena are being run off and JP is the king of running off kids. |
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olddave
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Post by olddave on Dec 29, 2017 9:21:43 GMT -5
While not enamored with JP and his recruiting, unfortunately the transfer rate for D1 is viral with coach's just trying to fill spots with a warm body , ala JP lazy recruiting. If, that's a big if, coach's do run off recruits, as long as they make sure the player is taken care of either another lower D1 program or D2 where they probably should have gone in the first place one can almost live with this new part of the equation in recruiting.
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OneIndian
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Post by OneIndian on Dec 29, 2017 9:26:57 GMT -5
Transfer willingly v. Run off are entirely different! Sure, because the only kids who leave Siena are being run off and JP is the king of running off kids. Yeah 👌. Jimbo hasn’t intentionally run some kids out of here, that’s what you’re implying? |
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Quackman
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Post by Quackman on Dec 29, 2017 9:42:12 GMT -5
Sure, because the only kids who leave Siena are being run off and JP is the king of running off kids. Yeah 👌. Jimbo hasn’t intentionally run some kids out of here, that’s what you’re implying? No, but your implication is that there is something different going on Siena as opposed to what is going on at other schools. Lots of kids are encouraged to leave (run off) at lots of different schools. Look no further than St. Fran who certainly encouraged some of his early recruits at Siena to look elsewhere. (Braga, Osby, Carr, Diop are names that comes to mind) And, I am not excusing it. I don't like running off players unless they are not living up to their end of the bargain (meaning going to class, working hard to get better and being a positive member of the team). I have no idea who, if anyone, has been run off under JP. Does being run off include a year end assessment where the coach tells a kid he is not likely to be in the playing group the following year? If that is case, then every coach in D1 is guilty of running off players. |
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Post by Deleted on Dec 29, 2017 10:07:51 GMT -5
Yeah 👌. Jimbo hasn’t intentionally run some kids out of here, that’s what you’re implying? No, but your implication is that there is something different going on Siena as opposed to what is going on at other schools. Lots of kids are encouraged to leave (run off) at lots of different schools. Look no further than St. Fran who certainly encouraged some of his early recruits at Siena to look elsewhere. (Braga, Osby, Carr, Diop are names that comes to mind) And, I am not excusing it. I don't like running off players unless they are not living up to their end of the bargain (meaning going to class, working hard to get better and being a positive member of the team). I have no idea who, if anyone, has been run off under JP. Does being run off include a year end assessment where the coach tells a kid he is not likely to be in the playing group the following year? If that is case, then every coach in D1 is guilty of running off players. You are intentionally leaving off the #1 JP reason to "encourage" a departure - drum roll please - "OMG - this kid doesn't fit with our scheme, what were we thinking, who recommended/offered him, he'll be fired at year end..." |
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glen
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Post by glen on Dec 29, 2017 11:32:18 GMT -5
Those numbers are outrageous. It is my feeling that this, as with most problems in education, starts with the parents. Many of these parents think their kid is the next Lebron and they push them higher than they should go or into the wrong fit. I'd personally rather see my son happy and playing at a D2 school than miserable and just practicing at a D1 school, but I don't think most parents are wired like that. They see the recruiting offers come in and get blinded by the lights. I bet a bunch of these kids accept offers without even visiting campus.
Even schools like UNC lose kids to transfer because the parent feels their kid should get more time or whatever.
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hoopdad
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Post by hoopdad on Dec 29, 2017 11:56:16 GMT -5
Thank you for posting this information. It backs up some of my previous posts regarding the high level of transfer in D1 Men's basketball. Very insightful and show that the Siena program is typical of what is going on today. Do not like it, but it is what it is.
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mjs72
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Post by mjs72 on Dec 29, 2017 13:37:06 GMT -5
Although these stats are from 2012, they are from a good source, the Chronicle of Higher Education, and find that almost 1/3 of all students transfer at least once before they get their bachelor's degree. I bet those numbers are higher now. My son who went to Quinny to play soccer transferred to Siena to be closer to home. My niece just transferred out of a school to change programs. It happens. And basketball players want to play. Not excusing HC's recruiting mistakes, but we aren't the only school seeing players leave. www.chronicle.com/article/A-Third-of-Students-Transfer/130954 |
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Post by Deleted on Dec 29, 2017 15:22:00 GMT -5
Although these stats are from 2012, they are from a good source, the Chronicle of Higher Education, and find that almost 1/3 of all students transfer at least once before they get their bachelor's degree. I bet those numbers are higher now. My son who went to Quinny to play soccer transferred to Siena to be closer to home. My niece just transferred out of a school to change programs. It happens. And basketball players want to play. Not excusing HC's recruiting mistakes, but we aren't the only school seeing players leave. www.chronicle.com/article/A-Third-of-Students-Transfer/130954From what I've read on this board, I think we all acknowledge transfers happen, it would be stupid to think otherwise unless of course you were Donald Trump. It's the seemingly increased number that we have seen that is alarming. |
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Post by greengold4ever on Dec 29, 2017 16:02:08 GMT -5
Thank you for posting this information. It backs up some of my previous posts regarding the high level of transfer in D1 Men's basketball. Very insightful and show that the Siena program is typical of what is going on today. Do not like it, but it is what it is. while all of this is true..............how do you look upon JP telling 2 players this yr to their face, that they will not be in the regular rotation, and may not see many minutes the entire yr (this coming from inside the lockerroom)................seems to me that is a bit contradictory to where we think transfers develop.......there is a major accountability on the one who brings these kids into a program, with nurturing/developing as part of the process......not everyone can be a star but pulling the rug from under student athletes is not what Siena is all about.............. |
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