Quackman
Team Captain
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Post by Quackman on Jan 31, 2014 16:53:18 GMT -5
Outside of maybe Downey, none of the guys you listed generated the type of debate that Hymes or Bisping generate. As much as the other guys games were discussed, I never saw one poster who thought Siena would be better off without them. Ok....your point is? My point is that he is probably the most intensely debated and galvanizing player in the internet era. The debate over the guys you pointed out centered on perceived flaws in their game as opposed to their worth as D1 basketball players. Posters opinions on Hymes range from Legitimate MAAC level player to D2 player. I am not pointing fingers or finding fault, just responding to your post.
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hoopjunkie
Associate Head Coach
Posts: 12,504
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Post by hoopjunkie on Jan 31, 2014 17:06:54 GMT -5
Hymes has his warts, like every player on this team except for maybe Poole and Wright, BUT we're definitely a better team with him. He does something no one on the team can do....create his own shot. He gave us a real good 17 min last night. That was Jimmys fault when Mason hit that jumper with a minute to go and took the lead. No way should Hymes A)be on the floor at that point or B) start out guarding the leagues best scorer when he could have easily been on Jordan instead. The offense-defense situational subbing was a possession too late, and it almost cost us. Evan will have his 1000th point before Valentines Day, and has an outside shot at being one of the top 10 scorers of all-time at Siena (let that soak in;) Hardly a kid that's in "over his head." lol i would say it was more like a good five minutes. he did spend his first 12 minutes or so gathering two turnovers (bad ones) and three fouls and a number of defensive lapses. i guess we saw a different game. im big on trumpeting scoring success for winners. Hymes has had a luxury i would guess most others in the top 10 did not have.... the green light on some pretty bad teams. Hymes will also wind up top 5 or so in turnovers i would guess. Hymes is a D1 scorer. his division one abilities begin and end there. Defensively hes one of the biggest liabilities on the court at all times. In controlled situations he is necessary for this team. I would hope and expect that this coaching staff can find a better answer than the current one. You need to stop blaming Evan for being surrounded by poor players during PW's time here. That's like blaming a a BYU/Fresno st in football for going undefeated. they beat who you put in front of them, and Evan played on the team PW gave him. Never seen a kid blasted this much and could be on the schools top ten scoring list......smh
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Post by psycholojets on Jan 31, 2014 17:22:50 GMT -5
I am NOT comparing their respective games but, it is not unlike Knicks fans blaming Melo for not being able to win games all by himself while on a team that is not constructed to extenuate his strengths and cover for his weaknesses. Evan was not recruited to be a savior or even a PTP really. The PW threw the car keys at him and said get me home kid. I think people got used to blaming him for late in the shot clock misses and cramping up after playing with limited rest therby leaving the team on the floor with nobody to run the offense under the PW's watchful eye. He is not a complete player but has significant strengths and a ton of heart. We should enjoy him while we can.
Just interesting that we don't seem to ride the other players for their respective weaknesses the way we do Evan.
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Post by siena12077 on Jan 31, 2014 19:44:00 GMT -5
I sincerely believe (and hope) that next year Wright, White, Long, Wolfe and JO will all make big sophomore jumps. Everyone knows that is when a college player improves the most. If these put in the hard work in the weight room and improve their game (I am confident that they will) next year and the two after that are going to be really special potentially for Siena basketball. Jimmy is getting a lot out of this team...we have a flawed roster but our kids are playing their asses off. Jimmy's intensity has really brought out good things in the team. The team is still learning how to win. We are getting there. Next step is beating a top level MAAC team at home. The first of those opportunities is against Quinnipiac tomorrow night. JO has a long long way to go. Should be 5th big off the bench behind Bisping, Long, Silas and Wolfe. He is sluggish and cant jump, doesnt have a good motor, can't play tough and rebound, slow to move his feet or jump so he hacks people for fouls. He is a big bodied 6'8" project who needs to improve many areas...mostly strength, agility and footwork
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Post by SaintsFan on Jan 31, 2014 21:25:42 GMT -5
i would say it was more like a good five minutes. he did spend his first 12 minutes or so gathering two turnovers (bad ones) and three fouls and a number of defensive lapses. i guess we saw a different game. im big on trumpeting scoring success for winners. Hymes has had a luxury i would guess most others in the top 10 did not have.... the green light on some pretty bad teams. Hymes will also wind up top 5 or so in turnovers i would guess. Hymes is a D1 scorer. his division one abilities begin and end there. Defensively hes one of the biggest liabilities on the court at all times. In controlled situations he is necessary for this team. I would hope and expect that this coaching staff can find a better answer than the current one. You need to stop blaming Evan for being surrounded by poor players during PW's time here. That's like blaming a a BYU/Fresno st in football for going undefeated. they beat who you put in front of them, and Evan played on the team PW gave him. Never seen a kid blasted this much and could be on the schools top ten scoring list......smh Never seen a kid chuck up shots like this with such a poor career win record and get hyped by a few people. If this kid was on Niagara or another school he would be shredded daily by siena fans. Aren't you blaming wincowski for being with low skilled teammates? If we went back and looked hymes is at best responsible for as many wins as he is losses And hymes didn't have good players??? Where does Anosike (maac first teamer and poy candidate) fit in? What SG is currently better than Downey on this team? What forward is better than wignot right now? Oh yeah... and he has had poole the whole time Bisping was here last year. Wow it really sounds like the same damn excuses people used for Mitch Much of it falls in Mitch's lap but Mitch's biggest mistake was handing a 5'6" guard the keys to the program. Sorry to break that reality. And siena has played against plenty of maac players who could score but not do much else. No thanks Hymes looks like nearly the exact same player as the last two years.
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Post by SaintsFan on Jan 31, 2014 21:29:40 GMT -5
I am NOT comparing their respective games but, it is not unlike Knicks fans blaming Melo for not being able to win games all by himself while on a team that is not constructed to extenuate his strengths and cover for his weaknesses. Evan was not recruited to be a savior or even a PTP really. The PW threw the car keys at him and said get me home kid. I think people got used to blaming him for late in the shot clock misses and cramping up after playing with limited rest therby leaving the team on the floor with nobody to run the offense under the PW's watchful eye. He is not a complete player but has significant strengths and a ton of heart. We should enjoy him while we can. Just interesting that we don't seem to ride the other players for their respective weaknesses the way we do Evan. Which freshman would you like me to ride the same as a junior who has much or more experience as most seniors? Long gets ridden a bit. As does Bisping... and white... and JO... and silas. None of which have nearly the experience that hymes does.
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Post by basketballfan on Feb 1, 2014 1:59:55 GMT -5
So will one of you genius please explain why two separate d1 coaching staff even play evan at all?
There are other players on the team.
I guess you could fault him for rahk and trenity fiasco. Evan should have recruited more talent. oh yea be is to fragile and is a d2 player. The team would have had more wins if only he would have done those things.
So will the brilliant basketball mind please explain why these two separate staff allow/allowed evan on the floor? Mitch and now jimmy ?
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Post by psycholojets on Feb 1, 2014 2:38:10 GMT -5
Yes he is 20 rather than 18 and your point is?
Sent from my SPH-L710 using proboards
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Post by Tony on Feb 1, 2014 4:50:19 GMT -5
You guys are funny- we keep going over same argument over and over. Yes Evan is limited defensively – he has however put much more effort into defense this year. And yes Evan is not a point guard – he is however a gifted scorer. He isn’t just chucking up shots, kid is fast and can get his own shot off two items desperately needed on this team this year – without Evan we don’t have more than a handful of wins. Other than Poole we don’t have any consistent scorers on this team- a team that by Jimmy’s own admission needs to score MORE if we are to compete with top MAAC teams. Give the kid his due- we don’t beat Niagara the other night without him- to say otherwise is to ignore the ‘limitations” this year’s Siena team has ( scoring points) and to use the old argument well how many did he give up—please--- no basketball game is won 10-9… you have to score points to win- Evan is explosive offensive threat .. none of you can come up with a better alternate to Evan this year – White is much better defensively – he is however not there offensively yet ( shooting 31% from floor and 8% from 3—not there yet. Oliver can’t really defend the two—Instead of attacking Evan you guys should be giving Jimmy credit for cobbling together a team made up of PW players and freshmen- we are limited up front- Silas can defend can’t stay on floor- Bisping can score- can’t defend athletic bigs, JO and Wolfe are not ‘ready ‘yet’ we have no true 2- Evan can score – struggles on D—White can defend has to get under control and shoot better.. we have 2 good players in Poole and Wright—( several freshmen that will turn into good players with work) I think its amazing the job Jimmy has done to this point. No need to trash Evan-- lets hope he plays well tonight- because we are going to need him
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Post by SaintsFan on Feb 1, 2014 8:18:56 GMT -5
You guys are funny- we keep going over same argument over and over. Yes Evan is limited defensively – he has however put much more effort into defense this year. And yes Evan is not a point guard – he is however a gifted scorer. He isn’t just chucking up shots, kid is fast and can get his own shot off two items desperately needed on this team this year – without Evan we don’t have more than a handful of wins. Other than Poole we don’t have any consistent scorers on this team- a team that by Jimmy’s own admission needs to score MORE if we are to compete with top MAAC teams. Give the kid his due- we don’t beat Niagara the other night without him- to say otherwise is to ignore the ‘limitations” this year’s Siena team has ( scoring points) and to use the old argument well how many did he give up—please--- no basketball game is won 10-9… you have to score points to win- Evan is explosive offensive threat .. none of you can come up with a better alternate to Evan this year – White is much better defensively – he is however not there offensively yet ( shooting 31% from floor and 8% from 3—not there yet. Oliver can’t really defend the two—Instead of attacking Evan you guys should be giving Jimmy credit for cobbling together a team made up of PW players and freshmen- we are limited up front- Silas can defend can’t stay on floor- Bisping can score- can’t defend athletic bigs, JO and Wolfe are not ‘ready ‘yet’ we have no true 2- Evan can score – struggles on D—White can defend has to get under control and shoot better.. we have 2 good players in Poole and Wright—( several freshmen that will turn into good players with work) I think its amazing the job Jimmy has done to this point. No need to trash Evan-- lets hope he plays well tonight- because we are going to need him I actually don't agree on the win total comments you guys make. You seem to forget the close games where he went on turnover/bad decision sprees that took siena out of the game. I think their win totals are pretty close to the same with or without him. Now if you want to make that same comment about Wright...
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Post by SaintsFan on Feb 1, 2014 8:26:10 GMT -5
So will one of you genius please explain why two separate d1 coaching staff even play evan at all? There are other players on the team. I guess you could fault him for rahk and trenity fiasco. Evan should have recruited more talent. oh yea be is to fragile and is a d2 player. The team would have had more wins if only he would have done those things. So will the brilliant basketball mind please explain why these two separate staff allow/allowed evan on the floor? Mitch and now jimmy ? If Cole was eligible... a guy recruited by this coach. We aren't having this discussion. If Brookins wasn't thieving... this staff let evan go. You're lying to yourself if you don't think patsos cringes every time he sends him to the scorers table. Hymes Audu Oliver brookins burdine. And Cole eligibility being declined by the ncaas. Those are the reasons he's even played
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Post by Tony on Feb 1, 2014 8:29:53 GMT -5
So will one of you genius please explain why two separate d1 coaching staff even play evan at all? There are other players on the team. I guess you could fault him for rahk and trenity fiasco. Evan should have recruited more talent. oh yea be is to fragile and is a d2 player. The team would have had more wins if only he would have done those things. So will the brilliant basketball mind please explain why these two separate staff allow/allowed evan on the floor? Mitch and now jimmy ? If Cole was eligible... a guy recruited by this coach. We aren't having this discussion. If Brookins wasn't thieving... this staff let evan go. You're lying to yourself if you don't think patsos cringes every time he sends him to the scorers table. Hymes Audu Oliver brookins burdine. And Cole eligibility being declined by the ncaas. Those are the reasons he's even played SO I see you admit no better options at the 2 this year-- thank you
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Post by SaintsFan on Feb 1, 2014 8:57:39 GMT -5
If Cole was eligible... a guy recruited by this coach. We aren't having this discussion. If Brookins wasn't thieving... this staff let evan go. You're lying to yourself if you don't think patsos cringes every time he sends him to the scorers table. Hymes Audu Oliver brookins burdine. And Cole eligibility being declined by the ncaas. Those are the reasons he's even played SO I see you admit no better options at the 2 this year-- thank you Exactly. He plays because we had one hell of a D2 roster being built by PW
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Post by jamalblack on Feb 1, 2014 10:23:37 GMT -5
What time do we play today.
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siena77
Sophomore
Posts: 617
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Post by siena77 on Feb 1, 2014 10:28:48 GMT -5
What time do we play today. 7 PM. Ceremony for the '89 & '94 teams supposed to occur before opening tip, I believe. Don't why it's not at halftime, but they're baffling me a lot lately.
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