gorvy
Associate Head Coach
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Post by gorvy on Mar 17, 2024 20:15:46 GMT -5
The big difference for me is the ncaa appearances. He had proven he was a successful coach by taking two programs with losing records and winning championships. The records are irrelevant to me because those two programs play a lot of guarantee games and were in a lower level league at the time. What's done is done Carm is our coach but if we are in the position again we should look to hiring someone who has already won championships... whether at a lower (are there any?) level d1 program or d2 or even d3 if the circumstances are right. There are never any guarantees regardless of where a coach comes from; Mike Maker was an exceptional winning coach (.830 pct / 4 deep runs into the D3 NCAA’a) but couldn’t cut it Marist. Jamion Christian had 2 NCAA’s and some success at MSM but his career flamed out. If NCAA’s and program elevation are part of your criteria, Will Brown at UA obviously meets and exceeds those prerequisites with 5 NCAA appearances. You also have a the option of Assistant coaches from varying P5/6/mids, we’ve had varied success and failure there as well. We’re closing in on 15 years of getting it wrong with DArgenio being the only constant. IMO regardless of where the next coach comes from, when and if it ever gets to that point, Siena needs to deviate from DArgenio and whatever hiring methodology he’s used in the past. I almost feel we need an AD change before this program can move forward, especially if we find ourselves in the position of making a coaching change. Sure no guarantees but at least you have a body of work that you can evaluate. With Fran I should have added that he won those championships by the third year. That's different than will. Then he came and did conferences super confident and saying the expectation was championships. Not "contend" or whatever bs comes out of our admin now. If an assistant is love it to come from a program with an exciting offense that theoretically he helped design. I'd also love the coach to demand more home games. Our schedule is unbalanced and it takes away the only advantage we have.
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Post by templesaint on Mar 17, 2024 22:30:54 GMT -5
I wanted Siena to look at Phil Martelli 5 years ago - he was just let go from St Joes and he still wanted to coach. He never had a hint of a violation his entire 30+ years at Hawk Hill. Siena fans would have loved him and he would have never left until he died. He had a pipeline ofcourse to Philly players - Siena always was good when a Philly area player was on the team - Matt Brady, Rick Williams, Ronald Moore, Alex Franklin etc.
He is now available after his assistant snit with Michigan??? Maybe him and his son could do a father / son - Homer / Bryce Drew thing.
I know it’s not reality as it’s 5 years too late and his is old…oh well
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Post by blockhead43 on Mar 18, 2024 9:30:06 GMT -5
Martelli would have been a good fit. And you are 100 percent correct, 5 years too late ... the story of Siena athletics under John D'Argenio's tutelage. D'Arg is always reactive and never proactive. It seems as if Siena basketball is always playing catch up to Iona, and now add St. Peter's to that list given its recent success. Give D'Arg credit, he's living his best life while being mediocre on his best day for the past 30 years. The rest of us suffer.
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OneIndian
Associate Head Coach
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Post by OneIndian on Mar 18, 2024 11:17:55 GMT -5
This institution doesn’t take its hoops program all that seriously. What they really want is a mid pack plus semi competitive program and a lifer coach who hovers around 500 plus that wins just enough to keep the negative emails away.
Passing on Pitino when you play in an empty NBA sized arena and have basically stunk for well over a decade tells you all that you need to know.
HOF Pitino offered a lifeline, a packed building, revenue bump, increased brand notoriety, immediate competitiveness and an instant path to recovery on his departure. We passed.
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glen
Team Captain
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Post by glen on Mar 18, 2024 13:47:31 GMT -5
Hey - if Michigan can fire Juwan Howard then maybe Siena can bin Carm!?
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Post by MTS on Mar 18, 2024 21:49:48 GMT -5
This institution doesn’t take its hoops program all that seriously. What they really want is a mid pack plus semi competitive program and a lifer coach who hovers around 500 plus that wins just enough to keep the negative emails away. Passing on Pitino when you play in an empty NBA sized arena and have basically stunk for well over a decade tells you all that you need to know. HOF Pitino offered a lifeline, a packed building, revenue bump, increased brand notoriety, immediate competitiveness and an instant path to recovery on his departure. We passed. Iona fans hate his guts. He left them high and dry. Sure he went to the NCAA twice just like SPU has done but they went on a historic run. Iona went 0-2 and now Tobin has to rebuild their roster again.
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OneIndian
Associate Head Coach
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Post by OneIndian on Mar 18, 2024 21:58:18 GMT -5
This institution doesn’t take its hoops program all that seriously. What they really want is a mid pack plus semi competitive program and a lifer coach who hovers around 500 plus that wins just enough to keep the negative emails away. Passing on Pitino when you play in an empty NBA sized arena and have basically stunk for well over a decade tells you all that you need to know. HOF Pitino offered a lifeline, a packed building, revenue bump, increased brand notoriety, immediate competitiveness and an instant path to recovery on his departure. We passed. Iona fans hate his guts. He left them high and dry. Sure he went to the NCAA twice just like SPU has done but they went on a historic run. Iona went 0-2 and now Tobin has to rebuild their roster again. 🙄
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Post by greengold4ever on Mar 19, 2024 5:57:48 GMT -5
Hey - if Michigan can fire Juwan Howard then maybe Siena can bin Carm!? honestly if Howard-Michigan, Mullen-St. Johns, Ewing-Georgetown and of course Ruland-Iona ...who were all LEGENDS at their schools as players can be shown the door as the HC because of things going south in their programs................it shouldn't be that much of a problem for Siena in their current situation, Carm was a player for only 1 yr here avg a whopping 3.5pts per game playing 11 minutes a game.........hardly any reason to keep him around if the "well he is one of our own" is the thought process, last 3 yrs has been a decline culminating in this seasons disaster..............
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glen
Team Captain
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Post by glen on Mar 19, 2024 7:48:53 GMT -5
I think the issue is they asked the faculty to take a 10% pay cut a few years ago. Not sure they ever made that up. To then give a failed sports coach $800K on the way out is a kick in the cajones to the faculty. I can understand their dilemma. Again, whoever agreed to that contract should be terminated. These people are effing idiots. There are only 350ish D1 jobs in the entire country. Likely <50 open on any given year. The school holds all the power yet we manage to sign contracts with losers that gives them all the control. I could see it for a coach like Pitino. For a guy like Carm? Morons, all of 'em.
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Post by sienabkenny on Mar 19, 2024 21:41:14 GMT -5
Donald Copeland is a name to watch.
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Post by plassmann on Mar 20, 2024 9:39:45 GMT -5
Let me again mention Herkimer CC coach Matt Lee as a realistic candidate to be Siena coach. Lee is as good of an “X’s and O’s “ guy as you will find. Why? Check out Lee’s win - loss record (this year 29- 3, lost last Saturday’s in NJCAA national title game. www.romesentinel.com/sports/collegiate/herkimer-college/herkimer-generals-fall-in-mens-basketball-national-title-game/article_d01914c6-e55b-11ee-9aa1-2b635167fc85.html ) In 2021-22, the Generals made their eighth appearance at the NJCAA Division III National Tournament in the past nine seasons. Coach Lee led the Generals to the 2019 NJCAA Division III National Championship for the second time in program history and was named the 2019 NJCAA Division III Men's Basketball Coach of the Year. The 2019 squad finished with a record of 31-1 and ended the season on a 28-game winning streak to claim the National Title. Since 2003, Lee has twelve regional finals appearances, seven Region III Championships (2010, 2013, 2014, 2015, 2017, 2018, and 2019), eight Mountain Valley Conference Championships (2007, 2010, 2012, 2013, 2015, 2016, 2017, 2019), and two 3rd place, three 4th place, one 5th place finish and one 7th place finish at Nationals. So the flat earth dreamers can have fantasies about Fran MCCaffery or Phil Martello or another D1 coach coming back to take over our once proud men’s basketball team but John Wooden is not walking through the door. Before anyone dismisses hiring a junior college coach google the background of John Beilein , Buzz Williams, Bob McKillop, Keith Dambrot, Leon Rice and others. Coach Lee knows how to hustle and find undervalued talent and win.
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Post by sienafanforever on Mar 20, 2024 10:20:10 GMT -5
Seems pretty clear that we can put this post to bed. There clearly isn't going to be a coaching change at this point so we are stuck with what we are stuck with. Our focus should be on what players are available and what players are departing (hopefully a handfull more). This may be a fun post to monitor but is pointless at this juncture in time anyway.
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$cott
Assistant Coach
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Post by $cott on Mar 20, 2024 10:20:27 GMT -5
Carm is going to win 15 games next year, get an extension, and be the Siena coach for the next 15 years as he leads the transition back to the ARC. That is what the admin wants.
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SIENA1971
Assistant Coach
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Post by SIENA1971 on Mar 20, 2024 10:23:14 GMT -5
Let me again mention Herkimer CC coach Matt Lee as a realistic candidate to be Siena coach. Lee is as good of an “X’s and O’s “ guy as you will find. Why? Check out Lee’s win - loss record (this year 29- 3, lost last Saturday’s in NJCAA national title game. www.romesentinel.com/sports/collegiate/herkimer-college/herkimer-generals-fall-in-mens-basketball-national-title-game/article_d01914c6-e55b-11ee-9aa1-2b635167fc85.html ) In 2021-22, the Generals made their eighth appearance at the NJCAA Division III National Tournament in the past nine seasons. Coach Lee led the Generals to the 2019 NJCAA Division III National Championship for the second time in program history and was named the 2019 NJCAA Division III Men's Basketball Coach of the Year. The 2019 squad finished with a record of 31-1 and ended the season on a 28-game winning streak to claim the National Title. Since 2003, Lee has twelve regional finals appearances, seven Region III Championships (2010, 2013, 2014, 2015, 2017, 2018, and 2019), eight Mountain Valley Conference Championships (2007, 2010, 2012, 2013, 2015, 2016, 2017, 2019), and two 3rd place, three 4th place, one 5th place finish and one 7th place finish at Nationals. So the flat earth dreamers can have fantasies about Fran MCCaffery or Phil Martello or another D1 coach coming back to take over our once proud men’s basketball team but John Wooden is not walking through the door. Before anyone dismisses hiring a junior college coach google the background of John Beilein , Buzz Williams, Bob McKillop, Keith Dambrot, Leon Rice and others. Coach Lee knows how to hustle and find undervalued talent and win. Let’s hope he’s still around a year from now … I’m not expecting any miracles for next season … my only expectation is it won’t be as bad as this season
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OneIndian
Associate Head Coach
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Post by OneIndian on Mar 20, 2024 10:33:26 GMT -5
Let me again mention Herkimer CC coach Matt Lee as a realistic candidate to be Siena coach. Lee is as good of an “X’s and O’s “ guy as you will find. Why? Check out Lee’s win - loss record (this year 29- 3, lost last Saturday’s in NJCAA national title game. www.romesentinel.com/sports/collegiate/herkimer-college/herkimer-generals-fall-in-mens-basketball-national-title-game/article_d01914c6-e55b-11ee-9aa1-2b635167fc85.html ) In 2021-22, the Generals made their eighth appearance at the NJCAA Division III National Tournament in the past nine seasons. Coach Lee led the Generals to the 2019 NJCAA Division III National Championship for the second time in program history and was named the 2019 NJCAA Division III Men's Basketball Coach of the Year. The 2019 squad finished with a record of 31-1 and ended the season on a 28-game winning streak to claim the National Title. Since 2003, Lee has twelve regional finals appearances, seven Region III Championships (2010, 2013, 2014, 2015, 2017, 2018, and 2019), eight Mountain Valley Conference Championships (2007, 2010, 2012, 2013, 2015, 2016, 2017, 2019), and two 3rd place, three 4th place, one 5th place finish and one 7th place finish at Nationals. So the flat earth dreamers can have fantasies about Fran MCCaffery or Phil Martello or another D1 coach coming back to take over our once proud men’s basketball team but John Wooden is not walking through the door. Before anyone dismisses hiring a junior college coach google the background of John Beilein , Buzz Williams, Bob McKillop, Keith Dambrot, Leon Rice and others. Coach Lee knows how to hustle and find undervalued talent and win. Nice bio but let’s be realistic Lee is not making a move from D3 Juco to D1. It took Tobin Anderson years to make the leap from D2. Some of the names you mentioned are ancient like McKillop (1970’s), some had higher HC experience some had higher level assistant experience prior to getting a D1 shot. Apples and oranges. Will Brown made the move from D2 Juco but UA was a start up D1 program and that was 25 years ago. It’s a lot different business - game today.
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