CellarRat
Assistant Coach
Enter your message here...
Posts: 4,330
Dislikes:
|
Post by CellarRat on May 27, 2018 10:38:51 GMT -5
Once again Hockeyguy should just watch Washington play Vegas in the Stanley cup finals and let Jamion get back to building Siena up. Next year is a "free" year for JC. I'm betting we win around 12 games give or take. He has a system that will throw teams off. Once he gets more talent we will hopefully see big time results. The recruiting class he signs this fall will be crucial. Already off to a good start with Carey (who essentially will be apart of it start playing in 2019-2020. I’m hoping for an above .500 campaign. I’ll be disappointed with less than that. At least half the Maac teams suck real bad. If he’s the real deal that should be the result.
|
|
Papi
Assistant Coach
Misinformation Troll
Posts: 5,591
Dislikes:
|
Post by Papi on May 27, 2018 10:43:16 GMT -5
Anything under 20 losses is mandatory. We all know what happens to any coach who loses 20 games in a season at Siena.
|
|
rpize24
Team Captain
Posts: 1,663
Dislikes:
|
Post by rpize24 on May 27, 2018 10:49:04 GMT -5
Once again Hockeyguy should just watch Washington play Vegas in the Stanley cup finals and let Jamion get back to building Siena up. Next year is a "free" year for JC. I'm betting we win around 12 games give or take. He has a system that will throw teams off. Once he gets more talent we will hopefully see big time results. The recruiting class he signs this fall will be crucial. Already off to a good start with Carey (who essentially will be apart of it start playing in 2019-2020. I’m hoping for an above .500 campaign. I’ll be disappointed with less than that. At least half the Maac teams suck real bad. If he’s the real deal that should be the result. In conference play is certainly possible as there won't be many very good teams, however on the season as a whole that is going to be very difficult to achieve in year one due to the transfers and late start he got. Do I expect the team to win 20 games or even be multiple games over .500? Not this year, but I expect the team to compete hard in every game and to see progress made throughout the season. Should be fun to watch as we haven't had an entertaining style of basketball played since Fran was here. Go saints!
|
|
mrsiena
Junior
Posts: 842
Dislikes:
|
Post by mrsiena on May 27, 2018 11:46:02 GMT -5
If I'm not mistaking didn't JP scale back the quality of the out of conference schedule for next year. If so, it should make it somewhat easier to get wins.
|
|
Sienafan
Team Captain
Posts: 2,498
Dislikes:
|
Post by Sienafan on May 27, 2018 12:19:51 GMT -5
The change may be well not produce any better results in the short term. But then that's largely a function of the remaining roster built by Patsos isn't it? If the best players that recently departed were mostly freshmen and the upperclassmen which remain are all role players, that serves to underscore a big reason why a change had to be made. Where are the talented upperclassmen who should be leading the team now? Regardless of whether one is a JP lover or hater, it's objectively pretty apparent that his recruiting was not good - bad enough that as soon as the last of Mitch's players departed, the team went straight to the bottom of the league. That fact is not debatable. As Bill Parcells famously said: You are what your record says you are. So you are correct that there may be no short term improvement. What would you have had Siena do - give Patsos another year to try to turn it around? Five years wasn't enough time? I don't think that would have produced notably better results. The roster wouldn't have remained intact even if Patsos had stayed. He annually lost players to transfer and would have again - the total over his tenure is astounding. Siena is wisely playing the long game. Sometimes you gotta take a step back before you make two steps forward. If we suffer another year at the bottom in trade for a rapid rise back to the top the year after that, I'll gladly take that trade. One thing is certain - Patsos was never going to win a title at Siena. He had half a decade to try. So it was time to make a change for better or for worse. Perhaps you can let JC get a few games under his belt and see what he can do first before you long for the days of JP. SF, you ask what would I have Siena do, it is more what would I have had them not do, specifically tie up a scholarship for 4 years in a questionable Seymour, and to a lesser degree on Pickett (based on the other schools interested, every coach in the Northeast had a chance to take a look at him and for the most part passed on him). They are two openings that will no longer be available next year, or three years after. I am willing to watch and see what happens and will root for the team, even driving 250 miles round trip to catch a few games at the TUC (provided I don't pack up my golf clubs and move to Charleston or Savannah by the autumn). I just might have approached things a little differently than the coach has, but hey, he's the coach, not me. Christian has already stated that he would not tie up scholarships on players that can't help the team. Why won't you give him the benefit of the doubt on that? We have a coach with a proven history of recruiting overlooked players who end up high-major level talents. I'm optimistic about the the chances that continues into his tenure at Siena. Seymour had a high-major offers at one point. I know that's no longer the case for whatever reason, but the kid showed something at some point to get them. JC went after him quickly after being hired - I'm betting JC has plans for him. I'm sure he can find a use for a 6'9 guy who shoots threes at a nearly 40% clip. Pickett was missing a test score that made him academically ineligible, hence no one offers regardless of which coaches saw him. Patsos wanted him too, but didn't offer for the same reason as everyone else. Well Pickett recently got the score and JC jumped on him. Canisius and St Peter's also came in with quick late offers as soon as he got the score. JC got him on campus and immediately closed the deal before any other competition came into the picture now that he was newly eligible. That's good recruiting. How often did you see Patsos close the deal on or immediately after a visit with a recruit that had other offers? So far JC has Pickett, Seymour, and Carey as a first recruiting class with one more to fill - all in May when he was hired. You apparently see that as a bad class for a late hire. You know what I see? A much more impressive late class as a new hire than Fran McCaffrey had: Osby, Diop, Braga, etc. - and the rest is history how well that tenure turned out. So it's all relative my friend.
|
|
musicman
Team Captain
Posts: 2,325
Dislikes:
|
Post by musicman on May 28, 2018 1:20:48 GMT -5
SF, you ask what would I have Siena do, it is more what would I have had them not do, specifically tie up a scholarship for 4 years in a questionable Seymour, and to a lesser degree on Pickett (based on the other schools interested, every coach in the Northeast had a chance to take a look at him and for the most part passed on him). They are two openings that will no longer be available next year, or three years after. I am willing to watch and see what happens and will root for the team, even driving 250 miles round trip to catch a few games at the TUC (provided I don't pack up my golf clubs and move to Charleston or Savannah by the autumn). I just might have approached things a little differently than the coach has, but hey, he's the coach, not me. Christian has already stated that he would not tie up scholarships on players that can't help the team. Why won't you give him the benefit of the doubt on that? We have a coach with a proven history of recruiting overlooked players who end up high-major level talents. I'm optimistic about the the chances that continues into his tenure at Siena. Seymour had a high-major offers at one point. I know that's no longer the case for whatever reason, but the kid showed something at some point to get them. JC went after him quickly after being hired - I'm betting JC has plans for him. I'm sure he can find a use for a 6'9 guy who shoots threes at a nearly 40% clip. Pickett was missing a test score that made him academically ineligible, hence no one offers regardless of which coaches saw him. Patsos wanted him too, but didn't offer for the same reason as everyone else. Well Pickett recently got the score and JC jumped on him. Canisius and St Peter's also came in with quick late offers as soon as he got the score. JC got him on campus and immediately closed the deal before any other competition came into the picture now that he was newly eligible. That's good recruiting. How often did you see Patsos close the deal on or immediately after a visit with a recruit that had other offers? So far JC has Pickett, Seymour, and Carey as a first recruiting class with one more to fill - all in May when he was hired. You apparently see that as a bad class for a late hire. You know what I see? A much more impressive late class as a new hire than Fran McCaffrey had: Osby, Diop, Braga, etc. - and the rest is history how well that tenure turned out. So it's all relative my friend. Amen brother!! You have summarized everything that has transpired beautifully. I hope everyone is trying to keep an open mind and not have a personal agenda due to the past. Let's look to the future..
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
Dislikes:
|
Post by Deleted on May 28, 2018 5:18:22 GMT -5
Seymour did not receive "high major offers at one point" - he had "high major INTEREST" only. The INTEREST was in large part due to relationships with his dad and seems to have disappeared as quickly at it appeared. It sounds like he could be a major challenge for JC; but maybe, just maybe a new HC, coupled with an exciting type of play and teammates who are hoping to collectively lift themselves off the mat, he (Seymour) will be stimulated to produce different than anticipated results. If the kid is really a square peg in a round hole, the summer conditioning program may round some corners and change some attitudes - we shall see, at least we are entering a new season with hope and some promise.
|
|
indian82
Assistant Coach
Posts: 6,450
Dislikes:
|
Post by indian82 on May 28, 2018 6:11:24 GMT -5
Seymour did not receive "high major offers at one point" - he had "high major INTEREST" only. The INTEREST was in large part due to relationships with his dad and seems to have disappeared as quickly at it appeared. It sounds like he could be a major challenge for JC; but maybe, just maybe a new HC, coupled with an exciting type of play and teammates who are hoping to collectively lift themselves off the mat, he (Seymour) will be stimulated to produce different than anticipated results. If the kid is really a square peg in a round hole, the summer conditioning program may round some corners and change some attitudes - we shall see, at least we are entering a new season with hope and some promise. Agreed. Have to believe our new coach sees something in Seymour that he feels he can use in his system. Let's all get behind him and see. Less than a month in.
|
|
bigsaintg
Assistant Coach
Posts: 6,971
Member is Online
Dislikes:
|
Post by bigsaintg on May 28, 2018 8:01:10 GMT -5
I also saw on Twitter this weekend that Steve coaches for the Ny Havoc which has quickly become a nice AAU program. I know Moll player fro them. Interestingly the MVP was Billy Lia, another Siena connection. Maybe Sloan get his mojo going and we have a good connection for players with the Havoc
|
|
|
Post by hockeyguy on May 28, 2018 8:03:00 GMT -5
Once again Hockeyguy should just watch Washington play Vegas in the Stanley cup finals and let Jamion get back to building Siena up. Next year is a "free" year for JC. I'm betting we win around 12 games give or take. He has a system that will throw teams off. Once he gets more talent we will hopefully see big time results. The recruiting class he signs this fall will be crucial. Already off to a good start with Carey (who essentially will be apart of it start playing in 2019-2020. Please give me the wisdom of your years of Division 1 experience as a player and a coach and look at my post where I provide the basis for my opinion, position by position, and critique what I was wrong on. Not just your empty bombast, but a reasoned analysis. If I thought you could afford it I would take you up on your 12 win "give or take" wager offer for $100. (give or take what? give 5, take 1?) I welcome your enlightenment.
|
|
|
Post by hockeyguy on May 28, 2018 8:11:28 GMT -5
SF, you ask what would I have Siena do, it is more what would I have had them not do, specifically tie up a scholarship for 4 years in a questionable Seymour, and to a lesser degree on Pickett (based on the other schools interested, every coach in the Northeast had a chance to take a look at him and for the most part passed on him). They are two openings that will no longer be available next year, or three years after. I am willing to watch and see what happens and will root for the team, even driving 250 miles round trip to catch a few games at the TUC (provided I don't pack up my golf clubs and move to Charleston or Savannah by the autumn). I just might have approached things a little differently than the coach has, but hey, he's the coach, not me. Christian has already stated that he would not tie up scholarships on players that can't help the team. Why won't you give him the benefit of the doubt on that? We have a coach with a proven history of recruiting overlooked players who end up high-major level talents. I'm optimistic about the the chances that continues into his tenure at Siena. Seymour had a high-major offers at one point. I know that's no longer the case for whatever reason, but the kid showed something at some point to get them. JC went after him quickly after being hired - I'm betting JC has plans for him. I'm sure he can find a use for a 6'9 guy who shoots threes at a nearly 40% clip. Pickett was missing a test score that made him academically ineligible, hence no one offers regardless of which coaches saw him. Patsos wanted him too, but didn't offer for the same reason as everyone else. Well Pickett recently got the score and JC jumped on him. Canisius and St Peter's also came in with quick late offers as soon as he got the score. JC got him on campus and immediately closed the deal before any other competition came into the picture now that he was newly eligible. That's good recruiting. How often did you see Patsos close the deal on or immediately after a visit with a recruit that had other offers? So far JC has Pickett, Seymour, and Carey as a first recruiting class with one more to fill - all in May when he was hired. You apparently see that as a bad class for a late hire. You know what I see? A much more impressive late class as a new hire than Fran McCaffrey had: Osby, Diop, Braga, etc. - and the rest is history how well that tenure turned out. So it's all relative my friend. SF, coach did not say he wouldn't tie up scholarships on kids that can't help the team, he said he was okay with keeping one or two scholarships open in one quote, and in another he said we won't take players just to take player, we can get ELITE talent, this is Siena. So far I have not seen that. That's all I was saying. I SUPPORT THE COACH. As for talented players transferring, if I believe the guru's on this board kids pick a program for the coach, so what's the deal with JC? Do they or don't they? How say you "experts"?
|
|
indian82
Assistant Coach
Posts: 6,450
Dislikes:
|
Post by indian82 on May 28, 2018 8:19:53 GMT -5
I also saw on Twitter this weekend that Steve coaches for the Ny Havoc which has quickly become a nice AAU program. I know Moll player fro them. Interestingly the MVP was Billy Lia, another Siena connection. Maybe Sloan get his mojo going and we have a good connection for players with the Havoc Is he a Lia from Guilderland? Didn't know they had anybody that good on Siena's radar.
|
|
bigsaintg
Assistant Coach
Posts: 6,971
Member is Online
Dislikes:
|
Post by bigsaintg on May 28, 2018 8:36:22 GMT -5
I also saw on Twitter this weekend that Steve coaches for the Ny Havoc which has quickly become a nice AAU program. I know Moll player fro them. Interestingly the MVP was Billy Lia, another Siena connection. Maybe Sloan get his mojo going and we have a good connection for players with the Havoc Is he a Lia from Guilderland? Didn't know they had anybody that good on Siena's radar. I don’t know that the kid is on Siena’s radar and he plays 15u. But given the family is a major sponsor and has half the court side seats it I a connection. He was an MVP of his divosion so obviously worth watching
|
|
Sienafan
Team Captain
Posts: 2,498
Dislikes:
|
Post by Sienafan on May 28, 2018 8:36:23 GMT -5
Christian has already stated that he would not tie up scholarships on players that can't help the team. Why won't you give him the benefit of the doubt on that? We have a coach with a proven history of recruiting overlooked players who end up high-major level talents. I'm optimistic about the the chances that continues into his tenure at Siena. Seymour had a high-major offers at one point. I know that's no longer the case for whatever reason, but the kid showed something at some point to get them. JC went after him quickly after being hired - I'm betting JC has plans for him. I'm sure he can find a use for a 6'9 guy who shoots threes at a nearly 40% clip. Pickett was missing a test score that made him academically ineligible, hence no one offers regardless of which coaches saw him. Patsos wanted him too, but didn't offer for the same reason as everyone else. Well Pickett recently got the score and JC jumped on him. Canisius and St Peter's also came in with quick late offers as soon as he got the score. JC got him on campus and immediately closed the deal before any other competition came into the picture now that he was newly eligible. That's good recruiting. How often did you see Patsos close the deal on or immediately after a visit with a recruit that had other offers? So far JC has Pickett, Seymour, and Carey as a first recruiting class with one more to fill - all in May when he was hired. You apparently see that as a bad class for a late hire. You know what I see? A much more impressive late class as a new hire than Fran McCaffrey had: Osby, Diop, Braga, etc. - and the rest is history how well that tenure turned out. So it's all relative my friend. SF, coach did not say he wouldn't tie up scholarships on kids that can't help the team, he said he was okay with keeping one or two scholarships open in one quote, and in another he said we won't take players just to take player, we can get ELITE talent, this is Siena. So far I have not seen that. That's all I was saying. I SUPPORT THE COACH. As for talented players transferring, if I believe the guru's on this board kids pick a program for the coach, so what's the deal with JC? Do they or don't they? How say you "experts"? I think it's pretty obvious that I was paraphrasing what he meant and didn't supply the exact quote. For someone who supposedly supports the coach, you sure have an odd way to of showing it. The dude was hired in May. I'm not sure what ELITE talent you were expecting at that late date. I think the pickups he achieved in such a sort time was frame are pretty good under the circumstances - a context that seems to elude you. You would have been one of the the meatballs complaining about Kenny Hasbrouck, who was recruited under similar circumstances. He wasn't exactly in high demand at the time of his commitment. What would you do...leave all 4 scholarships open while you hold out for blue chip recruits and proceed with only 9 scholarship players next season? Then when the inevitable injury bug hits you'd be killing JC for not adding more players. I guess with fans such as yourself you're dammed if you do, damned if you don't.
|
|
Quackman
Team Captain
Posts: 2,469
Dislikes:
|
Post by Quackman on May 28, 2018 8:45:50 GMT -5
Seymour did not receive "high major offers at one point" - he had "high major INTEREST" only. The INTEREST was in large part due to relationships with his dad and seems to have disappeared as quickly at it appeared. It sounds like he could be a major challenge for JC; but maybe, just maybe a new HC, coupled with an exciting type of play and teammates who are hoping to collectively lift themselves off the mat, he (Seymour) will be stimulated to produce different than anticipated results. If the kid is really a square peg in a round hole, the summer conditioning program may round some corners and change some attitudes - we shall see, at least we are entering a new season with hope and some promise. Well, Seymour had offers from Pitt, St Johns, UMass and South Florida as reported on twitter by multiple sources. Also, took unofficial visits to umass, Rutgers and South Florida. Took me about 30 seconds to find them on Twitter if you want to check.
|
|