sky
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Post by sky on Feb 8, 2018 14:09:34 GMT -5
With all of the business majors, businessmen and those with careers in finance we keep talking in hypothetical terms about the cost of replacing a coach. How about doing the math like a cost accountant with fixed and variable costs. Just for shits and giggles lets all give some input and work out a realistic opinion.
First...replacement cost...estimates from $800k to $1.2M
Items to resolve..
Realistic estimate of lost ticket sales
Estimated loss of revenue from Siena associated items
Effect on contract with Times Union Center
(Does anyone know the details)
Value of student applications vs Fran years
Estimated donner$$$ to resolve coach change
Does anyone care the give opinions, information or new ideas that we can hash around...
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Feb 8, 2018 14:11:22 GMT -5
Numbers are for losers.
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Post by gosaints on Feb 8, 2018 14:22:39 GMT -5
Not true! Successful organizations are always "running the numbers" to find out where they are doing well and where they are falling sort of expectations. Once they have this information they take/implement measures to correct the shortfalls and strengthen what is working. This sound business practice is one that Siena has apparently failed to adhere too. |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Feb 8, 2018 14:24:24 GMT -5
Not true! Successful organizations are always "running the numbers" to find out where they are doing well and where they are falling sort of expectations. Once they have this information they take/implement measures to correct the shortfalls and strengthen what is working. This sound business practice is one that Siena has apparently failed to adhere too. |
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Post by gosaints on Feb 8, 2018 14:44:09 GMT -5
Not true! Successful organizations are always "running the numbers" to find out where they are doing well and where they are falling sort of expectations. Once they have this information they take/implement measures to correct the shortfalls and strengthen what is working. This sound business practice is one that Siena has apparently failed to adhere too. Self serving but humorous as usual. |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Feb 8, 2018 14:47:16 GMT -5
Self serving but humorous as usual. Thanks. I usually tip myself pretty well too. |
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siena95
Sophomore
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Post by siena95 on Feb 8, 2018 14:47:40 GMT -5
Also add in whatever the cost of the assistant coaches contracts... even if they are only tied up for another year, you are talking another few $100K. Getting rid of Jimmy brings those additional costs.
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Post by greenblood on Feb 8, 2018 15:10:38 GMT -5
I would find it hard to believe that the assistants have any buy outs.
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siena95
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Post by siena95 on Feb 8, 2018 15:28:18 GMT -5
I would find it hard to believe that the assistants have any buy outs. I doubt they are year to year contracts. Maybe the DOB is, but other asst's may have came to siena from other places. I doubt they are moving w/o a few years of guarantee. |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Feb 8, 2018 16:59:41 GMT -5
I would find it hard to believe that the assistants have any buy outs. I doubt they are year to year contracts. Maybe the DOB is, but other asst's may have came to siena from other places. I doubt they are moving w/o a few years of guarantee. I'd be shocked if they weren't year to year - the assistants are hired AND FIRED by the head coach; the assistants may be given the option to stay but that is at the discretion of the AD. When so-so fired previous assistants I don't recall hearing about any buy outs from those guys and I doubt Siena would pay the tab for a so-so mistake/adjustment - hell, the assistants are then balls to the walls looking for their next job/paycheck (they may opt for their pay on a 12 month basis like teachers, but I really don't know if that is the case here). They get to go to the Final Four and numero uno priority is landing somewhere fast.... |
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Post by greenblood on Feb 8, 2018 17:11:25 GMT -5
I doubt they are year to year contracts. Maybe the DOB is, but other asst's may have came to siena from other places. I doubt they are moving w/o a few years of guarantee. I'd be shocked if they weren't year to year - the assistants are hired AND FIRED by the head coach; the assistants may be given the option to stay but that is at the discretion of the AD. When so-so fired previous assistants I don't recall hearing about any buy outs from those guys and I doubt Siena would pay the tab for a so-so mistake/adjustment - hell, the assistants are then balls to the walls looking for their next job/paycheck (they may opt for their pay on a 12 month basis like teachers, but I really don't know if that is the case here). They get to go to the Final Four and numero uno priority is landing somewhere fast.... Exactly. There was no buy-out for Craig Carter (either time) or Tobin Anderson I assure you. |
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gorvy
Associate Head Coach
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Post by gorvy on Feb 8, 2018 18:28:42 GMT -5
Ticket sales could be as much as $250,000 annually if 1,000 less show up at average price of $20 per game. Then there is corporate sponsorships, donors (which may go down anyway as a result of new tax code) and how much value they place on the visibility of a high quality d1 team. The opportunity cost of not having a good program as well — which is probably neglible considering maac socialism of NCAA revenue distribution. I don’t see $1.2 million here or $800,000, jmo but I sure am hoping.
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Post by goldsaint17 on Feb 8, 2018 18:35:49 GMT -5
Ticket sales could be as much as $250,000 annually if 1,000 less show up at average price of $20 per game. Then there is corporate sponsorships, donors (which may go down anyway as a result of new tax code) and how much value they place on the visibility of a high quality d1 team. The opportunity cost of not having a good program as well — which is probably neglible considering maac socialism of NCAA revenue distribution. I don’t see $1.2 million here or $800,000, jmo but I sure am hoping. I don’t think it has to be 800k. I think it needs to be 400k, enough to pull the trigger now instead of next year when it’s a more manageable number. |
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gorvy
Associate Head Coach
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Post by gorvy on Feb 8, 2018 18:43:01 GMT -5
Ticket sales could be as much as $250,000 annually if 1,000 less show up at average price of $20 per game. Then there is corporate sponsorships, donors (which may go down anyway as a result of new tax code) and how much value they place on the visibility of a high quality d1 team. The opportunity cost of not having a good program as well — which is probably neglible considering maac socialism of NCAA revenue distribution. I don’t see $1.2 million here or $800,000, jmo but I sure am hoping. I don’t think it has to be 800k. I think it needs to be 400k, enough to pull the trigger now instead of next year when it’s a more manageable number. I just hope whenever it is they leave enough funds to commit to a quality coach. As bad as this season is overall jimmy is actually a better coach than the last three we fired. Therefore we need an upgrade from that—- which will come at a price. I’d rather wait until we could afford a Nate Davis type than do it now and possibly get a guy like mike maker, for example. But hey fire away if the numbers are right. |
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Post by sienafanallyearlong2 on Feb 9, 2018 9:21:31 GMT -5
On paper(we know it's much lower in reality) at about 6000 per game this yr, we are about 1800 fans down per game from Fran's best year of 7800 per game. This was in his last year (meaning it took 5 full years of growing that fan base back to trusting you even with much success out on the court the previous 3 yrs).
If your talking about 17 games a year and an avg spend between the ticket/ concession stands/parking/bars/restaurant of $50 p/person p/game, the economical cost to Siena now vs. Siena then is about $1.5 million a year hit to the Siena brand, let alone student applications, school spirit, regional spirit, downtown Albany spirit, and lost opportunity of actually growing your business beyond the best of the Fran years to becoming a regional brand much like being a mini mid major to what Syracuse is in their very similar economic market but on a much larger scale.
YEAR-BY-YEAR SIENA BASKETBALL
TIMES UNION CENTER ATTENDANCE
Season Games Attendance Average
Deane
1990-91 6$& 64,177 10,699
1991-92 3& 22,185 7,395
1992-93 3& 21,480 7,160
1993-94 6#& 56,596 9,433
Beyer
1994-95 5% 24,159 4,831
1995-96 7% 23,955 3,422
1996-97 7 25,645 3,663
Hewitt
1997-98 16+ 90,126 5,632
1998-99 13 82,320 6,332
1999-00 18#+ 125,255 6,959
Orr
2000-01 13 83,213 6,401
Lanier
2001-02 17* 112,359 6,609
2002-03 17$ 125,156 7,362
2003-04 16+ 104,444 6,528
2004-05 13 83,723 6,440
Fran
2005-06 14% 78,378 5,598
2006-07 14 81,670 5,834
2007-08 17+ 110,012 6,471
2008-09 17+ 127,453 7,497
2009-10 17+ 133,505 7,853
Mitch
2010-11 15 114,383 7,626
2011-12 14 91,128 6,509
2012-13 14 89,053 6,361
Patsos
2013-14 17! 102,459 6,027
2014-15 16& 99,872 6,242
2015-16 17&@ 106,580 6,269
2016-17 16+ 97,238 6,077
(Total 348 2,279,523 6,550)
2017/18 ytd-12 gms-approx 72k=6k avg p/gm
^ Includes one NIT game
# Includes two NIT games
$ Includes three NIT games
% Includes one MAAC Tournament game
& Includes two MAAC Tournament games
+ Includes three MAAC Tournament games
*Includes four MAAC Tournament games
!Includes three College Basketball Invitational games
@includes one College Basketball Invitational game
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