SaintMisbehavin
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Post by SaintMisbehavin on Jan 29, 2013 11:03:05 GMT -5
Every thread seems to either start or devolve into a coaching debate. As a basketball fan, I thought I'd make an effort to bring some discussion to the players and their play. When looking at scoring projections during the pre-season, it was just about universally believed that the diminutive duo of Brookins and Hymes would average between 25-30 points per game. This has not consistently been the case. Looking solely at MAAC play after the new year, which is really the only time the two were consistently getting minutes together, here is how their scoring output breaks down: Opp. Hymes Brookins Total Result Iona 4 7 11 Competitive Loss Rider 5 6 11 Blowout Loss Canisius 20 13 33 Win St. Peters 12 18 30 Win Niagara 9 10 19 Blowout Loss Canisius 4 4 8 Blowout Loss Niagara 30 --- 30 Competitive Loss Marist 21 12 33 Win |
As you can see, the pair have combined to score 30+ in each conference win this year (with the exception of the Niagara game in which Hymes carried the load himself in a loss). In my opinion, having your starting guards maintain this scoring output is indicative of a few key things: 1. Making Defenses pay when they collapse/Double OD. 2. Improved shot selection (not GOOD, improved). 3. Bringing defenses out to cover scoring guards results in more open driving/cutting lanes for Poole and Burdine. I am fairly confident that if we will see this trend continue. If the guards can combine to score at least 25 a game, I believe that they will at least be competitive in a number of their remaining games. It will allow OD to "get his" and open up lanes for Poole and Burdine.
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Post by greengold4ever on Jan 29, 2013 12:08:56 GMT -5
Every thread seems to either start or devolve into a coaching debate. As a basketball fan, I thought I'd make an effort to bring some discussion to the players and their play. When looking at scoring projections during the pre-season, it was just about universally believed that the diminutive duo of Brookins and Hymes would average between 25-30 points per game. This has not consistently been the case. Looking solely at MAAC play after the new year, which is really the only time the two were consistently getting minutes together, here is how their scoring output breaks down: Opp. Hymes Brookins Total Result Iona 4 7 11 Competitive Loss Rider 5 6 11 Blowout Loss Canisius 20 13 33 Win St. Peters 12 18 30 Win Niagara 9 10 19 Blowout Loss Canisius 4 4 8 Blowout Loss Niagara 30 --- 30 Competitive Loss Marist 21 12 33 Win |
As you can see, the pair have combined to score 30+ in each conference win this year (with the exception of the Niagara game in which Hymes carried the load himself in a loss). In my opinion, having your starting guards maintain this scoring output is indicative of a few key things: 1. Making Defenses pay when they collapse/Double OD. 2. Improved shot selection (not GOOD, improved). 3. Bringing defenses out to cover scoring guards results in more open driving/cutting lanes for Poole and Burdine. I am fairly confident that if we will see this trend continue. If the guards can combine to score at least 25 a game, I believe that they will at least be competitive in a number of their remaining games. It will allow OD to "get his" and open up lanes for Poole and Burdine. while these are interesting numbers, other things will also determine when a game is competitive...........specifically, you addressed only the offensive side of the ball............clearly Siena has had issues there for sure, but it is also the defensive aspect that can make or break a possible outcome in games...........Mitch unfortunately, has been stubborn to a fault for not adjusting on BOTH ends of the court...........we have 3 wins in the league, 2 of which are against teams worse than us, and the other was a last second miracle..............if anything, the scheme, game planning and more importantly, the "in-game" adjustments should be more the focus than on what numbers we can get from players, because if those things are taken care of, you can expect positive numbers from a bunch of kids, IMHO!!!!!!!!!!!
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SaintMisbehavin
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Post by SaintMisbehavin on Jan 29, 2013 12:35:29 GMT -5
Streak of consecutive comments without mentioning a coach: zero.
The point of the initial post is that the scoring output of the two guards affects a number of other aspects of the team's play.
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Post by SaintsFan on Jan 29, 2013 12:56:32 GMT -5
Canisius is a bit overrated and we are now seeing that as being true Marist. St Peters are two of the worst teams in college hoop.
saintmisbehavin you have to understand that a big part of the reason you arent seeing the stat you want to see is because of the system/coaching. if it wasnt the case you wouldnt be hearing so many calls for his head nor be dead certain there was a definitive number on Mitch's days. (that number is without a doubt under 50)
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Post by SaintsFan on Jan 29, 2013 12:59:46 GMT -5
Streak of consecutive comments without mentioning a coach: zero. The point of the initial post is that the scoring output of the two guards affects a number of other aspects of the team's play. if they arent put in position to succeed by the system in place you can click your heals, toss a coin in a wishing well, wish upon a star, consult a medium, carry a rabbits foot, throw salt over shoulder, jump cracks on the side walk, avoid walking under a ladder, avoid black cats, wear your lucky clothes or whatever you want to do... it will not result in any success... and THAT is where everyone now is. People FINALLY realize where the issue is. Despite you not wanting to hear it... that is the coach
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SaintMisbehavin
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Post by SaintMisbehavin on Jan 29, 2013 13:16:13 GMT -5
Streak of consecutive comments without mentioning a coach: zero. The point of the initial post is that the scoring output of the two guards affects a number of other aspects of the team's play. if they arent put in position to succeed by the system in place you can click your heals, toss a coin in a wishing well, wish upon a star, consult a medium, carry a rabbits foot, throw salt over shoulder, jump cracks on the side walk, avoid walking under a ladder, avoid black cats, wear your lucky clothes or whatever you want to do... it will not result in any success... and THAT is where everyone now is. People FINALLY realize where the issue is. Despite you not wanting to hear it... that is the coach Got it. Just wanted to confirm that no one wanted to actually break down the game play this year. I have my answer. I by no means am attempting to endorse the current regime nor look at the few victories Siena has had as some landmark occurrence. What I am attempting to do is determine when we're successful, what are the key factors driving that success. There's only one player graduating off this team, you're still going to see a lot of familiar faces in Siena jerseys next year, despite who is on the bench.
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Post by SaintsFan on Jan 29, 2013 13:32:01 GMT -5
if they arent put in position to succeed by the system in place you can click your heals, toss a coin in a wishing well, wish upon a star, consult a medium, carry a rabbits foot, throw salt over shoulder, jump cracks on the side walk, avoid walking under a ladder, avoid black cats, wear your lucky clothes or whatever you want to do... it will not result in any success... and THAT is where everyone now is. People FINALLY realize where the issue is. Despite you not wanting to hear it... that is the coach Got it. Just wanted to confirm that no one wanted to actually break down the game play this year. I have my answer. I by no means am attempting to endorse the current regime nor look at the few victories Siena has had as some landmark occurrence. What I am attempting to do is determine when we're successful, what are the key factors driving that success. There's only one player graduating off this team, you're still going to see a lot of familiar faces in Siena jerseys next year, despite who is on the bench. ill break it down. The players are supposed to be in a system that takes advantage of their strengths and helps to hide weaknesses. They arent. I expect they will do relatively well when playing against crappy defensive teams and i expect them to struggle against anyone else. breaking it down would imply an attempt to fix it. According to the head coach, everything is fine its just bad luck that the other team has been hitting their shots.
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Post by greengold4ever on Jan 29, 2013 14:07:38 GMT -5
if they arent put in position to succeed by the system in place you can click your heals, toss a coin in a wishing well, wish upon a star, consult a medium, carry a rabbits foot, throw salt over shoulder, jump cracks on the side walk, avoid walking under a ladder, avoid black cats, wear your lucky clothes or whatever you want to do... it will not result in any success... and THAT is where everyone now is. People FINALLY realize where the issue is. Despite you not wanting to hear it... that is the coach Got it. Just wanted to confirm that no one wanted to actually break down the game play this year. I have my answer. I by no means am attempting to endorse the current regime nor look at the few victories Siena has had as some landmark occurrence. What I am attempting to do is determine when we're successful, what are the key factors driving that success. There's only one player graduating off this team, you're still going to see a lot of familiar faces in Siena jerseys next year, despite who is on the bench. and we won't exactly know who is staying or going, as well as recruits when the change is made.........right now, no player(s) are more important than the program itself................whatever fallout occurs we have to be ready for it and move forward!!!!!!!!!
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ltf
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Post by ltf on Jan 29, 2013 14:22:25 GMT -5
Saintmisbehaving: Nice try but you can lead a horse to water but you can't make him drink. Good effort, but trying to lead this group to discuss anything but the coach is about as effective as pounding sand down a rathole!
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SaintMisbehavin
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Post by SaintMisbehavin on Jan 29, 2013 14:31:43 GMT -5
Got it. Just wanted to confirm that no one wanted to actually break down the game play this year. I have my answer. I by no means am attempting to endorse the current regime nor look at the few victories Siena has had as some landmark occurrence. What I am attempting to do is determine when we're successful, what are the key factors driving that success. There's only one player graduating off this team, you're still going to see a lot of familiar faces in Siena jerseys next year, despite who is on the bench. ill break it down. The players are supposed to be in a system that takes advantage of their strengths and helps to hide weaknesses. They arent. I expect they will do relatively well when playing against crappy defensive teams and i expect them to struggle against anyone else. breaking it down would imply an attempt to fix it. According to the head coach, everything is fine its just bad luck that the other team has been hitting their shots. Thanks for humoring me in at least half your post. Appreciated. Fairfield and Manhattan have two of the league's strongest defenses per the most recent tempo-free stats. Clearly it will be a larger barrier to success this upcoming weekend than this past weekend's games.
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Post by MTS on Jan 29, 2013 14:52:56 GMT -5
Got it. Just wanted to confirm that no one wanted to actually break down the game play this year. I have my answer. I by no means am attempting to endorse the current regime nor look at the few victories Siena has had as some landmark occurrence. What I am attempting to do is determine when we're successful, what are the key factors driving that success. There's only one player graduating off this team, you're still going to see a lot of familiar faces in Siena jerseys next year, despite who is on the bench. and we won't exactly know who is staying or going, as well as recruits when the change is made.........right now, no player(s) are more important than the program itself................whatever fallout occurs we have to be ready for it and move forward!!!!!!!!! Exactly hopefully most will stay but if some choose to go leave we will wish them well and move on to the next player. No one player or coach is bigger than the program as you said. To be successful you need a good head coach and good players. If you have one but not the other you won't be truly successful.
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glen
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Post by glen on Jan 29, 2013 15:19:03 GMT -5
Discussing anything at this point is sorta useless. Why discuss strategies that in the end will be foiled. It would be great if the back court combined for 30+ every night. Heck, if the other 3 positions combined for 45 that would be swell too. Dang, if we had 1 impact player who we could count on for 20+ (with some subs to add another 10 or so) we'd be much better off as well.
If our zone was a little better and reduced the number of layups the other team scored we'd have a greater chance of winning. Additionally, if we were able to play man and reduce the number of wide open 3's the other teams shot we'd have won a few extra.
If we had a 15 or 16 man roster we could weather the injuries and *short* bench that has stymied us all year long.
And look I didn't mention anything objectionable...
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SaintMisbehavin
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Post by SaintMisbehavin on Jan 29, 2013 15:43:08 GMT -5
All right then, I'll catch everyone in mid-March. Fun stuff.
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Post by Tony on Jan 29, 2013 16:23:57 GMT -5
I'll say this I hope Baghdad plays Burdine more at the four... We were a little small but gave us some mismatches..and lets face it we have got next to nothing this year from Silas/Bisping/Martens at the 4
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Post by SaintsFan on Jan 29, 2013 20:42:11 GMT -5
I'll say this I hope Baghdad plays Burdine more at the four... We were a little small but gave us some mismatches..and lets face it we have got next to nothing this year from Silas/Bisping/Martens at the 4 I would rather he not. He has been injured often and playing out of position against much larger/stronger players is a recipe for injury
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