Post by MTS on Apr 30, 2014 15:08:39 GMT -5
Amedio lost the battle and decided to delete my last posts once he lost the agreement.
Here's the deleted post:
You're right Steve...just like you were right about the following things:
When you reported Fran was going to Penn (which was picked up nationally).
That Rob Lanier could lose every game his last year and be back as coach the following year at Siena (on John Graney's radio show.
Mitch Buonaguro will be back for his fourth season at Siena.
That Jimmy Patsos was younger than Fran McCaffery when he took the job.
Apparently you need to do more research. Your track record has been less stellar.
Post a Comment On: Keepin' Track of the MAAC
"Team Report: Siena Men Set To Compete For Crown"
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Blogger Mike D'Amico said...
Don't think Patsos is going anyplace for a while even with a couple of MAAC titles. Fran McCaffery stayed 5 years and he was known as a "climber". Patsos has only been at 2 schools (Maryland and Loyola) in 22 years prior to Siena and only in one area (DC/Maryland). Very possible unless Maryland comes calling he's here for a very long time.
April 26, 2014 at 8:54 PM
Delete
Blogger Steve Amedio said...
No coach, as history shows, is going to stay at Siena if he has success and bigger schools come calling. Do the financial math. Doesn't take a genius to figure why coaches move from Siena, and other MAAC schools. Follow the money.
April 27, 2014 at 10:39 AM
Blogger Mike D'Amico said...
I agree but Patsos isn't young and an up and comer" i.e. Hewitt gone in 3 years. I expect him for at least 5 years like McCaffery was. His career record isn't great (like Fran's was early in his career at Siena).
But yes there is a limit you can pay in the MAAC. All the more reason Siena will be in the A10 as soon as they are invited.
April 27, 2014 at 2:56 PM
Delete
Blogger Steve Amedio said...
He's younger than McCaffery was when he was here. Plus, he's already been at the highest level, at Maryland, as an assistant. Another real good season and he'll be a very attractive candidate to move.
As for A10 ... Don't hold your breath on that one.
Don't forget ... It's not just a basketball move. Every program at the school would have to make the move.
Plus, to be competitive, almost certainly have to lower academic standards. Not sure if that's part of Siena's philosophy.
As for Patsos' career record ... How about taking a Loyola program that was just about the worst in the country the year before his arrival and, then, having the best record in the MAAC in his last two seasons there ... At a lacrosse school?
You "expect" him to be here five years?
How would you know that?
April 27, 2014 at 5:33 PM
Blogger Mike D'Amico said...
McCaffery was 45 when he took the Siena job, Patsos was 46 when Siena hired him.
Maybe you're right Steve. But BCS jobs don't grow on trees. And not many of them are given to coaches with .519 or similar winning percentages (Patsos' current record)
April 27, 2014 at 7:05 PM
Delete
Blogger Steve Amedio said...
McCaffery was actually about a month shy of 46 when he became Siena coach, and 46 1/2 when he coached his first game ... so, basically, the same age.
You certainly can structure facts to suit your purpose ...
But, how about this? Loyola had one winning season in the MAAC before Patsos got there. The program was in shambles, ranked 2nd from last among 340, or so, D-I schools, the year before he got hired.
An admitted "lacrosse school." Players in the Balt/D.C. area were "ashamed" to have to settle for a Loyola scholarship (that's the word used by a former Loyola coach). Patsos not only had to build a team, but he had to revitalize an entire program. Which he did in pretty short order.
He had five winning seasons in his nine, and another at .500 exactly. His last two seasons: 47-21, best record of any MAAC program. Then, to turn around Siena so quickly ... Saints almost universally predicted to finish 10th this past season, and rightly so. Fabulous coaching job turned things around quicker than expected.
You think other schools haven't noticed?
Plus, he's already had a lot of ACC experience as an assistant.
Add all of that up.
What part of that isn't attractive to the next level?
And, what was Fran's coaching record before he got to Siena?
It was 139-126, at far lower-level programs, and ones in much better shape when he took over than Loyola was when Patsos was hired.
Nice to be optimistic about Patsos being here long term. But, in truth, you have no idea.
For that matter, I'm not certain either.
My best guess is based on him being a very attractive candidate elsewhere if Siena's 2014-15 is as good as everyone expects; and, that every single MAAC coach who has ever been offered a significantly better job elsewhere has moved on.
April 29, 2014 at 8:15 AM
Blogger Mike D'Amico said...
Let's see Lehigh was 95-196 in the previous 12 seasons before Fran McCaffery arrived. Lehigh had 1 winning seasons dating back to the 1960's. Totally baron program.
Greensboro was 26-59 the previous three years he took that job and had 3 winning seasons total in their brief D1 history. Since he left they've had two winning seasons.
And McCaffery was an assistant at Notre Dame for 11 years. Pretty big time program.
McCaffery took two different schools to the NCAA tournament. UNCG with absolutely no resources playing a bunch of guarantee games and Lehigh with tough academic standards.
Jimmy is a solid coach - the point is he has a ways to go to get high-major interest with his resume.
April 29, 2014 at 2:56 PM
Delete
Blogger Steve Amedio said...
Let's see ... Lehigh was 12-19 the year before Fran arrived there, and had every player of significance returning.
UNC-G was 84-87 in the six years before Fran and, again, had a loaded roster returning when Fran was hired (if you bothered to research any of that).
Loyola was the absolute worst D-I program in the country when Patsos was hired.
That Fran had to play some guarantee games (2 or 3 annually) at UNC-G doesn't figure in this at all relative to NCAA appearances. All his teams at UNC-G/Lehigh had to do was win their respective leagues' automatic berths ... leagues far, far inferior to the MAAC.
Yeah, Fran an assistant at ND, a "pretty big time" program.
But, the ND staff got fired in Fran's last season there (1998-99).
And, ND's program wasn't even close to Maryland's, which WON a national championship when Patsos was an assistant there.
I'm not going to continue this debate with you since you really have no idea whatsoever about how high-major programs perceive Patsos and whether he's an attractive candidate to move on in the near future.
April 30, 2014 at 7:04 AM
Blogger Steve Amedio said...
Mike: As indicated ... debate time is over. Not going to allow derogatory, half-true comments in this forum.
If you've got that much of a problem with what appears here, contact me privately via facebook or email.
April 30, 2014 at 12:57 PM
Derogatory, half-true commments? Everything in the deleted post was on the money.
Patsos resume is good but no better than Fran's pre Siena. I'm not saying Jimmy will be here forever but I'm betting at least the 5 years that Fran was here (hopefully more) and if he goes we'll tip our hat and say well done because it will have meant many Siena wins and conference championships!!
Here's the deleted post:
You're right Steve...just like you were right about the following things:
When you reported Fran was going to Penn (which was picked up nationally).
That Rob Lanier could lose every game his last year and be back as coach the following year at Siena (on John Graney's radio show.
Mitch Buonaguro will be back for his fourth season at Siena.
That Jimmy Patsos was younger than Fran McCaffery when he took the job.
Apparently you need to do more research. Your track record has been less stellar.
Post a Comment On: Keepin' Track of the MAAC
"Team Report: Siena Men Set To Compete For Crown"
9 Comments - Show Original Post Collapse comments
1 – 9 of 9
Blogger Mike D'Amico said...
Don't think Patsos is going anyplace for a while even with a couple of MAAC titles. Fran McCaffery stayed 5 years and he was known as a "climber". Patsos has only been at 2 schools (Maryland and Loyola) in 22 years prior to Siena and only in one area (DC/Maryland). Very possible unless Maryland comes calling he's here for a very long time.
April 26, 2014 at 8:54 PM
Delete
Blogger Steve Amedio said...
No coach, as history shows, is going to stay at Siena if he has success and bigger schools come calling. Do the financial math. Doesn't take a genius to figure why coaches move from Siena, and other MAAC schools. Follow the money.
April 27, 2014 at 10:39 AM
Blogger Mike D'Amico said...
I agree but Patsos isn't young and an up and comer" i.e. Hewitt gone in 3 years. I expect him for at least 5 years like McCaffery was. His career record isn't great (like Fran's was early in his career at Siena).
But yes there is a limit you can pay in the MAAC. All the more reason Siena will be in the A10 as soon as they are invited.
April 27, 2014 at 2:56 PM
Delete
Blogger Steve Amedio said...
He's younger than McCaffery was when he was here. Plus, he's already been at the highest level, at Maryland, as an assistant. Another real good season and he'll be a very attractive candidate to move.
As for A10 ... Don't hold your breath on that one.
Don't forget ... It's not just a basketball move. Every program at the school would have to make the move.
Plus, to be competitive, almost certainly have to lower academic standards. Not sure if that's part of Siena's philosophy.
As for Patsos' career record ... How about taking a Loyola program that was just about the worst in the country the year before his arrival and, then, having the best record in the MAAC in his last two seasons there ... At a lacrosse school?
You "expect" him to be here five years?
How would you know that?
April 27, 2014 at 5:33 PM
Blogger Mike D'Amico said...
McCaffery was 45 when he took the Siena job, Patsos was 46 when Siena hired him.
Maybe you're right Steve. But BCS jobs don't grow on trees. And not many of them are given to coaches with .519 or similar winning percentages (Patsos' current record)
April 27, 2014 at 7:05 PM
Delete
Blogger Steve Amedio said...
McCaffery was actually about a month shy of 46 when he became Siena coach, and 46 1/2 when he coached his first game ... so, basically, the same age.
You certainly can structure facts to suit your purpose ...
But, how about this? Loyola had one winning season in the MAAC before Patsos got there. The program was in shambles, ranked 2nd from last among 340, or so, D-I schools, the year before he got hired.
An admitted "lacrosse school." Players in the Balt/D.C. area were "ashamed" to have to settle for a Loyola scholarship (that's the word used by a former Loyola coach). Patsos not only had to build a team, but he had to revitalize an entire program. Which he did in pretty short order.
He had five winning seasons in his nine, and another at .500 exactly. His last two seasons: 47-21, best record of any MAAC program. Then, to turn around Siena so quickly ... Saints almost universally predicted to finish 10th this past season, and rightly so. Fabulous coaching job turned things around quicker than expected.
You think other schools haven't noticed?
Plus, he's already had a lot of ACC experience as an assistant.
Add all of that up.
What part of that isn't attractive to the next level?
And, what was Fran's coaching record before he got to Siena?
It was 139-126, at far lower-level programs, and ones in much better shape when he took over than Loyola was when Patsos was hired.
Nice to be optimistic about Patsos being here long term. But, in truth, you have no idea.
For that matter, I'm not certain either.
My best guess is based on him being a very attractive candidate elsewhere if Siena's 2014-15 is as good as everyone expects; and, that every single MAAC coach who has ever been offered a significantly better job elsewhere has moved on.
April 29, 2014 at 8:15 AM
Blogger Mike D'Amico said...
Let's see Lehigh was 95-196 in the previous 12 seasons before Fran McCaffery arrived. Lehigh had 1 winning seasons dating back to the 1960's. Totally baron program.
Greensboro was 26-59 the previous three years he took that job and had 3 winning seasons total in their brief D1 history. Since he left they've had two winning seasons.
And McCaffery was an assistant at Notre Dame for 11 years. Pretty big time program.
McCaffery took two different schools to the NCAA tournament. UNCG with absolutely no resources playing a bunch of guarantee games and Lehigh with tough academic standards.
Jimmy is a solid coach - the point is he has a ways to go to get high-major interest with his resume.
April 29, 2014 at 2:56 PM
Delete
Blogger Steve Amedio said...
Let's see ... Lehigh was 12-19 the year before Fran arrived there, and had every player of significance returning.
UNC-G was 84-87 in the six years before Fran and, again, had a loaded roster returning when Fran was hired (if you bothered to research any of that).
Loyola was the absolute worst D-I program in the country when Patsos was hired.
That Fran had to play some guarantee games (2 or 3 annually) at UNC-G doesn't figure in this at all relative to NCAA appearances. All his teams at UNC-G/Lehigh had to do was win their respective leagues' automatic berths ... leagues far, far inferior to the MAAC.
Yeah, Fran an assistant at ND, a "pretty big time" program.
But, the ND staff got fired in Fran's last season there (1998-99).
And, ND's program wasn't even close to Maryland's, which WON a national championship when Patsos was an assistant there.
I'm not going to continue this debate with you since you really have no idea whatsoever about how high-major programs perceive Patsos and whether he's an attractive candidate to move on in the near future.
April 30, 2014 at 7:04 AM
Blogger Steve Amedio said...
Mike: As indicated ... debate time is over. Not going to allow derogatory, half-true comments in this forum.
If you've got that much of a problem with what appears here, contact me privately via facebook or email.
April 30, 2014 at 12:57 PM
Derogatory, half-true commments? Everything in the deleted post was on the money.
Patsos resume is good but no better than Fran's pre Siena. I'm not saying Jimmy will be here forever but I'm betting at least the 5 years that Fran was here (hopefully more) and if he goes we'll tip our hat and say well done because it will have meant many Siena wins and conference championships!!
