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Post by greenblood on Jan 15, 2018 11:08:35 GMT -5
Hiring Mitch made absolutely no sense whatsoever.Rob Lanier might have been our best recruiter ever at Siena but his coaching style was very appealing to a fan as he never ,ever played an up-tempo type of game which reflected his recruits.Maybe he learned his lesson the first time around and if he ever gets another chance could be succesful.GO SAINTS! actually i would argue that Lanier recruited plenty of runners (Haddix excluded and one of my least favorites . He just didnt know HOW to. Lanier literally tried to bring BCS basketball to Siena when he needed to bring the athletes he brought and RUN them. He simply didnt know how. FANTASTIC recruiter. None better in the history of the school. Second closest was McCaffery. and most dont know... outside of McCaffrey... Lanier's Tommy Mitchell was closest to the big time. He nearly made an NBA roster multiple times. He was a guy who needed the running game here at Siena but never got it. One of my all time favorites. Absolutely agree with this. In his defense (and I admit this is hindsignt) Rob was very young and 'feeling his way to an identity' during his tenure here. Not sure he will ever want a HC position again, but don't see him leaving the south as Emory is excelling in Football and the entire family loves Knoxville.
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Post by Tony on Jan 15, 2018 11:30:43 GMT -5
Mitch was a horrible hire and made absolutely zero sense. After the shot clock was phased out of existence Mitch had 5 straight LOSING seasons at Fairfield. I didn’t make up the term program wrecker- that term was used to describe Mitch’s time at FF. Who cares what the players wanted- Fran lobbied for him so he didn’t have to take him to Iowa , Fr Kevin listened to Fran and Players and wanted to give Mitch ( a genuine nice guy in person) a second chance. Mitch was a terrible failure at FF and continued that trend at Siena- there is a reason why if a coaches at mid major level is fired he almost never gets a second chance. So-so is like John Wooden compared to Mitch- BTW Mitch in addition to breaking several Bob Beyer losing records at Siena, Mitch holds several MAAC losing records- he had 8 straight losing seasons ( 4 of them single digit win seasons)
The Mitch hire was one of biggest mistakes Siena ever made- and most people in the know knew it right off the bat- once again our esteemed AD gave an known loser coach with no other options a 4 year guaranteed contract- Darg should have been fired for that alone
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Post by greengold4ever on Jan 15, 2018 12:53:02 GMT -5
Mitch was a horrible hire and made absolutely zero sense. After the shot clock was phased out of existence Mitch had 5 straight LOSING seasons at Fairfield. I didn’t make up the term program wrecker- that term was used to describe Mitch’s time at FF. Who cares what the players wanted- Fran lobbied for him so he didn’t have to take him to Iowa , Fr Kevin listened to Fran and Players and wanted to give Mitch ( a genuine nice guy in person) a second chance. Mitch was a terrible failure at FF and continued that trend at Siena- there is a reason why if a coaches at mid major level is fired he almost never gets a second chance. So-so is like John Wooden compared to Mitch- BTW Mitch in addition to breaking several Bob Beyer losing records at Siena, Mitch holds several MAAC losing records- he had 8 straight losing seasons ( 4 of them single digit win seasons) The Mitch hire was one of biggest mistakes Siena ever made- and most people in the know knew it right off the bat- once again our esteemed AD gave an known loser coach with no other options a 4 year guaranteed contract- Darg should have been fired for that alone OMG, what BS..............sure Fran told you that, LOL
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gorvy
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Post by gorvy on Jan 15, 2018 12:53:11 GMT -5
Hiring Mitch made absolutely no sense whatsoever.Rob Lanier might have been our best recruiter ever at Siena but his coaching style was very appealing to a fan as he never ,ever played an up-tempo type of game which reflected his recruits.Maybe he learned his lesson the first time around and if he ever gets another chance could be succesful.GO SAINTS! sorry, but as stated, hiring Mitch at the time made the most sense for the school (reasons listed above in prior post plus he got Fran's endorsement which meant ALOT at the time no matter what any of us thought).........that is why they chose Mitch thinking things would stay status quo..........of course, it turned out bad but the reasons for him "to them" out-weighed the negative from their perspective.........they took a chance and it crapped out, but they did the right thing within 3 yrs............yet getting back to where they wanted to go after Mitch was not done correctly, therein lies the incompetency of the JP hire and where we are today........... Sorry but I completely disagree and can’t believe that some of you haven’t learned their lesson. If you are a winning coach you win, period. Siena new full well that Mitch had failed 20 years prior to hire. No other program was chomping at the bit to hire Mitch to lead their program despite his marked success as a top assistant for a top 50-75 program, and neither should Siena have. It was a predictable result and a terrible hire.
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Post by greengold4ever on Jan 15, 2018 12:57:44 GMT -5
sorry, but as stated, hiring Mitch at the time made the most sense for the school (reasons listed above in prior post plus he got Fran's endorsement which meant ALOT at the time no matter what any of us thought).........that is why they chose Mitch thinking things would stay status quo..........of course, it turned out bad but the reasons for him "to them" out-weighed the negative from their perspective.........they took a chance and it crapped out, but they did the right thing within 3 yrs............yet getting back to where they wanted to go after Mitch was not done correctly, therein lies the incompetency of the JP hire and where we are today........... Sorry but I completely disagree and can’t believe that some of you haven’t learned their lesson. If you are a winning coach you win, period. Siena new full well that Mitch had failed 20 years prior to hire. No other program was chomping at the bit to hire Mitch to lead their program despite his marked success as a top assistant for a top 50-75 program, and neither should Siena have. It was a predictable result and a terrible hire. the premise is WHY the school took a chance on him...........that's it, sometimes the devil you know is better than the devil you don't know, so they went what they considered in their minds as the "safe" hire............not saying I agreed with, but that I understood why they did it.............the hiring of JP made NO SENSE..........imho.....
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th24
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Post by th24 on Jan 15, 2018 13:02:41 GMT -5
Siena is probably not going to like it! But Siena might have to dish out some serious money for a GREAT head coach.They can’t afford to be cheap!
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wwii
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Post by wwii on Jan 15, 2018 17:50:43 GMT -5
Siena is probably not going to like it! But Siena might have to dish out some serious money for a GREAT head coach.They can’t afford to be cheap! They already do.
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gorvy
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Post by gorvy on Jan 15, 2018 18:19:06 GMT -5
Siena is probably not going to like it! But Siena might have to dish out some serious money for a GREAT head coach.They can’t afford to be cheap! They already do. . No, they don’t.
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th24
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Post by th24 on Jan 15, 2018 20:01:05 GMT -5
Question?! Was Fan’s starting and ending contract the same as Jimmys?!
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glen
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Post by glen on Jan 15, 2018 20:07:25 GMT -5
Money isn't the problem ... at least salary-wise. They just need to make good picks. Butler and Xavier come to mind as schools that have had a bunch of turnover but kept the train rolling. Yes, they pay more but they are in the Big East. Siena pays reasonably for a MAAC school - actually I think we pay OK evern for an A10 school. THey just need to structure contracts where they can eject a bad coach more easily...and make better picks so they don't have to.
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Post by goldsaint17 on Jan 15, 2018 20:32:59 GMT -5
Siena’s pay is okay for a MAAC school, not an A10. Other than maybe an NEC coach; we don’t pay well enough to grab an existing D1 Head Coach unless they feel the opportunity here is so much better that they take a lateral move. Honestly some of the assistants we’d be looking at wouldn’t be getting that big a pay raise, they’d take it as a chance to move up.
Money talks in this business, and not just in salary for the head coach. Not only did Quinny step up to the plate financially in giving Dunleavy a huge salary, they also gave him a big assistant coaching pool. That’s how they can afford to have Pecora, the Associate HC at Boston U, and an assistant at Yale plus doubling Harkins’ salary for the same DOBO position he had at Siena. I’m not sure the money is there for JP to go out and grab a strong assistant with head coaching experience, our staffs since JP have gotten here have really only had 1 coaching “veteran” in Luke D’Alessio and he wasn’t exactly a superstar. Others have all been young guys, and last year when we were discussing a possible new assistant Fruscio was the talk of the town. It takes a whole staff to win.
Siena must step up to the plate financially to get and keep a good new head coach.
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th24
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Post by th24 on Jan 15, 2018 23:16:04 GMT -5
Edwin Ubiles talks Siena Basketball! /photo/1
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Papi
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Post by Papi on Jan 16, 2018 8:29:50 GMT -5
Edwin Ubiles talks Siena Basketball! /photo/1 Let him have it guys. He said JP is a good coach and hopefully things turn around. Edwin's a fluffer.
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Post by greengold4ever on Jan 16, 2018 9:11:00 GMT -5
Edwin Ubiles talks Siena Basketball! /photo/1 Let him have it guys. He said JP is a good coach and hopefully things turn around. Edwin's a fluffer. no need..............."I haven't watched too much"......that's not exactly giving anyone the warm & fuzzies about what Edwin has noticed............"he's tough to play for, but I think he is a good coach"................hmmm, this alone speaks volumes coming from a player and not a resounding endorsement..........."He's a good guy. I've spoken to him several times"...............no question, JP off the court is as likable a "character" as you will find, engaging, approachable, funny, etc.....once you put him in a basketball setting, it's a disaster................
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Post by greengold4ever on Jan 16, 2018 9:23:54 GMT -5
sorry, but as stated, hiring Mitch at the time made the most sense for the school (reasons listed above in prior post plus he got Fran's endorsement which meant ALOT at the time no matter what any of us thought).........that is why they chose Mitch thinking things would stay status quo..........of course, it turned out bad but the reasons for him "to them" out-weighed the negative from their perspective.........they took a chance and it crapped out, but they did the right thing within 3 yrs............yet getting back to where they wanted to go after Mitch was not done correctly, therein lies the incompetency of the JP hire and where we are today........... - A) hiring a coach that had been fired as a head coach (IN YOUR OWN CONFERENCE) before - stupid - B) Mitch's personality was a sure failure as the face of the program - C) NO WAY IN HELL is Fran going to sell out a coach who gave his all to him. This was a clear case of failure to do due diligence by Siena. Siena was taken advantage of to give an aging man a last ditch chance. Wrong time, wrong place for second chances. Why in the world do you think NO OTHER SCHOOL gave him a second chance in the decades in between. You have arguably THE most professional coach (Hewitt is right there) to have EVER coached at the school and joe "the doorknob" used car salesman and somehow you convince yourselves it is going to be "the status quo" ? you know what... maac fans might be on to something saying Siena and its fans are the most delusional. go have a conversation with mitch. One single two minute conversation. Then come back and talk to me about how it was the right decision at the time. Idiocy. The PATSOS hire can be argued to have siena desperately seeking a known commodity and attempt to right the titanic with the hire. (and no i didnt like this hire either.) But at least it can be understood to some extent even i i dont agree with it. With Buonaguro, NOTHING WHATSOEVER told me that it was even remotely having a chance of working out. Tony called the Patsos hire to a T. Mediocrity at best with a once every few years competing to be in the top 3 or 4. not discounting anything you say.............but many on this same board were against Hewitt (as in Blew it) and also Fran when they were hired...........yet some on here thought Orr was a great hire, egads..............yet they were ambivalent to Lanier.................bottom line, all come with question marks (even the so called good ones).............the hiring process is really the crux of the matter, as it appears to lack consistency on how the actual hiring is done (is it a committee, is it the AD, school president......or some combination of these)..............
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