nolesaint
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Post by nolesaint on Aug 21, 2015 6:58:31 GMT -5
Does anyone know if anyone on the team may not have had their academics in order? Every year, around the country, when school starts back up there are players who have been dropped due to academics and lots of times there isn't any indication before hand that they were in jeopardy of losing their eligibility. Not saying that is or that I want it to be the case with our boys. It is however a way that this may work itself out...
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Post by billmurray on Aug 21, 2015 7:45:08 GMT -5
I can't remember the last te this happened at Siena.
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SIENA1971
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Post by SIENA1971 on Aug 21, 2015 8:21:34 GMT -5
Does anyone know if anyone on the team may not have had their academics in order? Every year, around the country, when school starts back up there are players who have been dropped due to academics and lots of times there isn't any indication before hand that they were in jeopardy of losing their eligibility. Not saying that is or that I want it to be the case with our boys. It is however a way that this may work itself out... Siena keeps their athletes on a short leash when it comes to academics . . . remember last season when Evan had to stay back on campus to complete an in-classroom assignment & missed a game.
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bison137
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Post by bison137 on Aug 21, 2015 9:19:43 GMT -5
If we're talking about Iona they'd get said player eligible from the NCAA. With all JO's been through with the losses of his mother and cousin you'd think the NCAA with show him some heart. This is an interesting situation but I've seen a similar situation twice before and the player had immediate eligibility when he returned to his original school. The NCAA bylaws support that. Here are the relevant parts: * 14.5.5.1 General Rule. A transfer student from a four-year institution shall not be eligible for intercollegiate competition at a member institution until the student has fulfilled a residence requirement of one full year (two full semesters or three full quarters) at the certifying institution. * 14.5.5.2.8 Return to Original Institution Without Participation or With Minimal Participation EXCEPTION. The student transfers to a second four-year collegiate institution, does not compete at the second institution and does not engage in other countable athletically related activities in the involved sport at the second institution beyond a 14-consecutive-day period and returns to the original institution. The 14-consecutive-day period begins with the date on which the student-athlete first engages in any countable athletically related activity (see Bylaw 17.02.1). A student may use this exception even if he or she has an unfulfilled residence requirement at the institution from which he or she is transferring. My Note: This says a player does not have to sit out if he returns to his original school IF he didn't engage in "countable athletically related activities" for more than 14 consecutive days. See definitions in next sections.* 17.02.1 Countable Athletically Related Activities. Countable athletically related activities include any required activity with an athletics purpose involving student-athletes and at the direction of, or supervised by, one or more of an institution’s coaching staff (including strength and conditioning coaches) and must be counted within the weekly and daily limitations under Bylaws 17.1.6.1 and 17.1.6.2. My Note: But see the next clause which limits when "countable athletically related activities" can occur. * 17.1.6.2.1 Institutional Vacation Period and Summer. - 17.1.6.2.1.1 Sports Other Than Championship Subdivision Football. In sports other than championship subdivision football, a student-athlete may not participate in any countable athletically related activities outside the playing season during any institutional vacation period and/or summer. Strength and conditioning coaches who are not countable coaches and who perform such duties on a department-wide basis may design and conduct specific workout programs for student-athletes, provided such workouts are voluntary and conducted at the request of the student-athlete. My Note: According to this section, an athlete CANNOT participate in ANY "countable athletically related activities" during a summer session. The only workouts he legally could have done at Boston U would have been voluntary ones for strength and conditioning. No basketball coaches or others on the basketball staff are allowed to be involved in any summer activities. Since he couldn't have been involved in "countable athletically related activities", he should be immediately eligible upon his return to Siena.Maybe there is something very unusual in his case, but I would be surprised if he has to sit, based on both the bylaws and similar situations in the past. This doesn't help with the scholarship situation however. Not sure how you'd get around that, other than to have Gottfried voluntarily give up his scholarship for a year. There is one other possible loophole, although I doubt it would be allowed in this case. On a couple of occasions, a team has had a senior get hurt early in the season and be awarded a 5th year via medical hardship waiver (often incorrectly called a redshirt). However these teams had already committed to 13 scholarships for the next year and didn't want to have to run a player off in the spring. In a couple cases, the NCAA allowed them to issue a 14th scholarship for a year, with the quid pro quo being that they could only give out 12 the following year. I doubt that would happen here, but I guess it's possible.
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musicman
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Post by musicman on Aug 21, 2015 12:42:37 GMT -5
good stuff bison. well done!
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IndianSaint
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Post by IndianSaint on Aug 21, 2015 15:45:55 GMT -5
Bison, I don't think JO would have to sit out the year for registering & practicing at BU (others might but not me). Siena should be able to get JO right away or at least obtain a "waiver" to play right away.
The bigger issues there's no ship available this year. That's the main talk of JO sitting out 1yr (mainly).
It's still my option (no facts) that Cam will most likely give up his ship "for the team" (since he's a team player & his father can afford the tuition).
So I except JO not only back in team and eligible to play this season but also have his ship. If not, no big deal he'll sit out one yr until a ship becomes available (not because the NCAA makes him sit out a yr for transfer reasons). JMO
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OneIndian
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Post by OneIndian on Aug 21, 2015 15:51:55 GMT -5
Bison, I don't think JO would have to sit out the year for registering & practicing at BU (others might but not me). Siena should be able to get JO right away or at least obtain a "waiver" to play right away. The bigger issues there's no ship available this year. That's the main talk of JO sitting out 1yr (mainly). It's still my option (no facts) that Cam will most likely give up his ship "for the team" (since he's a team player & his father can afford the tuition). So I except JO not only back in team and eligible to play this season but also have his ship. If not, no big deal he'll sit out one yr until a ship becomes available (not because the NCAA makes him sit out a yr for transfer reasons). JMO Let's not let emotion get in the way of logic.There are major hurdles with both the scholarship and waiver. Neither will be easy to overcome !
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Post by MTS on Aug 21, 2015 15:52:33 GMT -5
Bison, I don't think JO would have to sit out the year for registering & practicing at BU (others might but not me). Siena should be able to get JO right away or at least obtain a "waiver" to play right away. The bigger issues there's no ship available this year. That's the main talk of JO sitting out 1yr (mainly). It's still my option (no facts) that Cam will most likely give up his ship "for the team" (since he's a team player & his father can afford the tuition). So I except JO not only back in team and eligible to play this season but also have his ship. If not, no big deal he'll sit out one yr until a ship becomes available (not because the NCAA makes him sit out a yr for transfer reasons). JMO That can't or shouldn't happen. If the NCAA makes JO sit out, that sucks but that's the NCAA being the NCAA. But if the NCAA clears him (I think that they'll show some common sense for once I hope so anyway) JO will play. Otherwise Jimmy is going to once again feel the wrath of the Siena fans and so is Cam. Cam doesn't need a ship - JO does. Jimmy needs to win NOW. JO will help that cause - Cam won't. It's not fair you say JP promised him a 'ship? Well compare what JO and Cam have gone through in their lives and what economic backgrounds they have. I think Cam will be OK. I hope he is willing to be a "team" player.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 21, 2015 16:16:47 GMT -5
A man's word is his bond. You think JP wants to publicly piss off one of the major coaches in college basketball?
Until JO is in uniform, I'll remain at least somewhat skeptical that he both plays and is on scholarship. At least for this year. Maybe arrangements can be made for him to take the year off and be back next year but for next year it seems tough to me.
I'm rooting for him to be out there but until I see an official announcement...it's all just speculation.
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IndianSaint
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Post by IndianSaint on Aug 21, 2015 16:37:53 GMT -5
Bison, I don't think JO would have to sit out the year for registering & practicing at BU (others might but not me). Siena should be able to get JO right away or at least obtain a "waiver" to play right away. The bigger issues there's no ship available this year. That's the main talk of JO sitting out 1yr (mainly). It's still my option (no facts) that Cam will most likely give up his ship "for the team" (since he's a team player & his father can afford the tuition). So I except JO not only back in team and eligible to play this season but also have his ship. If not, no big deal he'll sit out one yr until a ship becomes available (not because the NCAA makes him sit out a yr for transfer reasons). JMO Let's not let emotion get in the way of logic.There are major hurdles with both the scholarship and waiver. Neither will be easy to overcome ! No emotion, I don't see the NCAA standing in the way of JO being eligible this yr. Based on the facts that Bison listed and the waiver options for various family reasons. The bigger issue is the ship.
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IndianSaint
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Post by IndianSaint on Aug 21, 2015 16:42:46 GMT -5
A man's word is his bond. You think JP wants to publicly piss off one of the major coaches in college basketball? Until JO is in uniform, I'll remain at least somewhat skeptical that he both plays and is on scholarship. At least for this year. Maybe arrangements can be made for him to take the year off and be back next year but for next year it seems tough to me. I'm rooting for him to be out there but until I see an official announcement...it's all just speculation. I hear you (wait & see, no speculation). I love to speculate and more so in an optimistic way. I don't think Cam giving up his ship would piss of his dad or risk any personal issues between Cam's dad & Jimmy. Cam's dad should know what coaches have to deal with & I believe Cam's dad would understand what Jimmy's dealing with (a potential very good player coming back vs. his son's ship). I don't see that as big a hurdle as others. That's why I'm optimistic. The worst case is JO has to sit a yr & gets a ship next year, no big deal, Siena stills wins. I'm just optimistic he'll play this year. No facts, but It's still what I think.
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Post by MTS on Aug 21, 2015 17:25:42 GMT -5
A man's word is his bond. You think JP wants to publicly piss off one of the major coaches in college basketball? Until JO is in uniform, I'll remain at least somewhat skeptical that he both plays and is on scholarship. At least for this year. Maybe arrangements can be made for him to take the year off and be back next year but for next year it seems tough to me. I'm rooting for him to be out there but until I see an official announcement...it's all just speculation. I hear you (wait & see, no speculation). I love to speculate and more so in an optimistic way. I don't think Cam giving up his ship would piss of his dad or risk any personal issues between Cam's dad & Jimmy. Cam's dad should know what coaches have to deal with & I believe Cam's dad would understand what Jimmy's dealing with (a potential very good player coming back vs. his son's ship). I don't see that as big a hurdle as others. That's why I'm optimistic. The worst case is JO has to sit a yr & gets a ship next year, no big deal, Siena stills wins. I'm just optimistic he'll play this year. No facts, but It's still what I think. Jimmy on 104.5 last night - 1045theteam.com/at-the-post-live-week-5/He mentioned JO will be back. That's a lock. I'm sure they'll work something out regarding the scholarship. The determining factor if JO can play next year will be NCAA hardship waiver IMO. Jimmy said JO will be in school. If he wasn't going to be on scholarship why wouldn't he just go to HVCC? Even with financial aid a year at Siena is a lot of money (taking out student loans).
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hoopjunkie
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Post by hoopjunkie on Aug 21, 2015 18:43:40 GMT -5
JO has about a 75% chance of being eligible right away. Aid from the school could let us get to the 14 number since this is such an unusual case.
There's also still a chance someone leaves, or goes to prep school, freeing up a scholarship.
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bigsaintg
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Post by bigsaintg on Aug 21, 2015 19:11:05 GMT -5
Can a recruit go to prep if he took classes and then come back?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 21, 2015 19:13:28 GMT -5
JO has about a 75% chance of being eligible right away. Aid from the school could let us get to the 14 number since this is such an unusual case. There's also still a chance someone leaves, or goes to prep school, freeing up a scholarship. Hmmm "Leaves"
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