Which came first the chicken or the egg?

[Deleted]

This was triggered by the year our women are having but I chose to throw it out here as the discussion would prove interesting re men's hoop as well as women's, IMO. I also see it dovetailing with the discussion on staffing changes seen as necessary on Jimmy's staff.

Ali made a complete staffing overhaul and was then dealt a serious blow leaving her with only seven players. We know how that has gone and it's a winning story.

With only seven players available, coaching style has to change somewhat, I would think. You can't put someone in the doghouse in practice and keep them there into a game. You have to manage resources during a game and allow players room to make and play through inevitable mistakes. During the MAAC tournament, I was impressed with her positive attitude towards players she was pulling primarily, it would seem, because they were screwing up. When those players went in later they played very well - no hangover due to a coaches tirade.

My question - how much of this season's success on the women's team do you think was due to the staffing change or the forced coaching changes due to the reduced available playing group? I personally feel the number seven had more to do with it than the staff changes even though both occurred in the same season.

[gorvy]

That's a great question. I can't answer as I only saw two games, one up close. I noticed the positive encouragement (although I also saw and heard a footstomp and "BOX OUT!" lol). By all accounts the recruits have ticked up a notch--- don't know how much that had to do with assistants. Something has to give, the injuries are a cop out excuse-- plenty of other teams were missing players, even star ones, and still managed to beat us. It's not going to be fixed by luck alone. Patsos has brought in some recruits that are used to winning. If we are still losing we will know for sure (without a doubt in my mind) what is up.

[bigsaintg]

As with many turn around successes, it's a combination of things. I agree having an experienced #2 like Stephanie Mac helps a lot. They got some really good recruits who have a team first attitude and play as a team. I do agree having only 7 makes it easier to manage in some ways. I agree being able to play through mistakes also helps. I sit behind the bench when I can so I can hear her coach. She can yell when she has to but also hugs kids, smiles a lot and seems to have a real rapport with the kids. She also gets on the entire bench if they are not cheering enough. The injured kids get water for the players and they really seem to have a bond. Some of her players are just special kids that have the IT factor like T-Coles and Margot. I think Kollyns will be an all time HOF player by the time she is done. Losing can be humbling and I think Ali may have learned some things as this is her first HC gig, while Jimmy has been doing it awhile. She seems humbled by last season and will savor this season and learn from it. She is also a good recruiter who forms a bond with players early - see her Twitter account for examples. She brought in a new assistant in Bridgette and she paid immeditae dividiends with Kei Perrymen. Went to same HS and got her over much bigger programs.

[sienahusker]

Mitch's best season recordwise was when he only had 6 players to game manage so there is something to the reduced numbers. The biggest challenge for Ali will be re-creating the team chemistry with a full squad. These girls really care about and play hard for each other; its very evident when you watch them play. Credit to the coaches for that. By all accounts Ali has a great recruiting class coming in. It will be interesting comparing and contrasting the men's and women's programs next year.

[IndianSaint]

I also agree it's probably a little of both. Coach Mac (IMO) was a great addition. I've also thought maybe Ali settled on her first batch of assistants due to time constraints in searching for more experienced ones when first hired. I believe the current coaching staff has more experience than first yr in addition that experience comes from better programs.

Coach had to allow players to play through bad spurts. It'll be interesting next yr when she'll have 15 available players.

I'd still give the edge to the coach and assistants (plus this was Ali's 3rd yr with team). Ali had two full yes with seeing the MAAC competition.

[musicman]

Mar 24, 2015 14:38:36 GMT -5 IndianSaint said:

I also agree it's probably a little of both. Coach Mac (IMO) was a great addition. I've also thought maybe Ali settled on her first batch of assistants due to time constraints in searching for more experienced ones when first hired. I believe the current coaching staff has more experience than first yr in addition that experience comes from better programs.

Coach had to allow players to play through bad spurts. It'll be interesting next yr when she'll have 15 available players.

I'd still give the edge to the coach and assistants (plus this was Ali's 3rd yr with team). Ali had two full yes with seeing the MAAC competition.

Good points by IS. It was Ali's third year. I remember negative comments being thrown around a little after the previous year's season and record.. I think she has continued to grow each season, has upped the recruitment level and this staff has done a nice job since they have arrived. The injection of youth and new talent has certainly helped this year's record. Ali has started 2 freshmen and a sophomore all season with a sophomore and a junior coming off the bench. This year's freshmen were signed before our new coaches were even working with Ali. Definitely the egg ! But it's been a combination of several things all being good. One of our top recruits never even got to play this year due to knee surgery and we have possibly the best recruitment class in Siena's history coming in next year. Things look very bright!