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Cole
Jun 24, 2014 15:21:47 GMT -5
Post by MTS on Jun 24, 2014 15:21:47 GMT -5
So no one confirms or denies this. Basically no clue if there even is an issue. Hypothetically speaking though, if Cole were out for the year and we knew now, how much would people's expectations change for next year? I don't know about others, but for me, this is like scratching a brick wall with a wooden nail. I want to see him take a step forward and be another solid player for us as much as the next guy but it would just be one less contributor and a loss that we could certainly survive. We went 18-11 last year post-Old Spice without him. Without Cole we'd have traded just Audu and Hopper for Paige, WB, and Gottfried and everyone would be a year wiser. It's not like this would affect much. Even if the frosh are complete busts, we should still be a better team than last year. I'd still have very high expectations. Siena was 17-10 (.630) after the exams break so this is already a very good team without Cole. It would hurt but I'd still think Siena would have a really good chance to win the title. The "manageable" OOC schedule would start to look like a good thing. There's only one irreplaceable guy on the roster and that's Marquis Wright. Just like with Ubiles, Hasbrouck, Rossiter and Franklin - Moore was the one guy who had to stay healthy. Please put Wright in a bubble, Jimmy Fingers are crossed for Pat...hopefully there's no structural damage and he's ready to go for October!
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Cole
Jun 24, 2014 15:30:37 GMT -5
Post by MTS on Jun 24, 2014 15:30:37 GMT -5
Per Singelais twitter Siena's Patrick Cole hurt his right knee in Sunday's workout. He's waiting for results of an MRI. Said he's not too concerned. Siena's Patrick Cole (knee) done w/ summer workouts, which go on another 2 weeks. Could be out 6 weeks, Patsos said. Might need knee scoped. As stated, it's early but hopefully he is alright. That's very good news. Let him rest and rehab. Being out 6 or even 10 weeks is not a big deal in June. My biggest fear was an ACL. A knee scoped now would not be a major thing. He should be fine by October. And in game shape in plenty of time for November 14th the season opener at UMass.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 24, 2014 15:34:26 GMT -5
So no one confirms or denies this. Basically no clue if there even is an issue. Hypothetically speaking though, if Cole were out for the year and we knew now, how much would people's expectations change for next year? I don't know about others, but for me, this is like scratching a brick wall with a wooden nail. I want to see him take a step forward and be another solid player for us as much as the next guy but it would just be one less contributor and a loss that we could certainly survive. We went 18-11 last year post-Old Spice without him. Without Cole we'd have traded just Audu and Hopper for Paige, WB, and Gottfried and everyone would be a year wiser. It's not like this would affect much. Even if the frosh are complete busts, we should still be a better team than last year. I'd still have very high expectations. Siena was 17-10 (.630) after the exams break so this is already a very good team without Cole. It would hurt but I'd still think Siena would have a really good chance to win the title. The "manageable" OOC schedule would start to look like a good thing. There's only one irreplaceable guy on the roster and that's Marquis Wright. Just like with Ubiles, Hasbrouck, Rossiter and Franklin - Moore was the one guy who had to stay healthy. Please put Wright in a bubble, Jimmy Fingers are crossed for Pat...hopefully there's no structural damage and he's ready to go for October! My expectations would not change by 1 win. Wright, Poole, Long, and Bisping are the key players. Oliver, Paige, and WB are the potetial upside scorers. Everybody else has their jobs and should do it as good or better overall. Cole has upside too but all we need is one or 2 to step up. I am honestly afraid of Cole a little. I feel that Oliver's contributions from a ball control and rebounding perspective are underappreciated. We need a 2nd guard in the lineup who is gonna take care of the ball. I'm a little afraid of Cole "Rakeem Brookinsing us to death" like in MB3.
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Cole
Jun 24, 2014 15:46:13 GMT -5
Post by MTS on Jun 24, 2014 15:46:13 GMT -5
I'd still have very high expectations. Siena was 17-10 (.630) after the exams break so this is already a very good team without Cole. It would hurt but I'd still think Siena would have a really good chance to win the title. The "manageable" OOC schedule would start to look like a good thing. There's only one irreplaceable guy on the roster and that's Marquis Wright. Just like with Ubiles, Hasbrouck, Rossiter and Franklin - Moore was the one guy who had to stay healthy. Please put Wright in a bubble, Jimmy Fingers are crossed for Pat...hopefully there's no structural damage and he's ready to go for October! My expectations would not change by 1 win. Wright, Poole, Long, and Bisping are the key players. Oliver, Paige, and WB are the potential upside scorers. Everybody else has their jobs and should do it as good or better overall. Cole has upside too but all we need is one or 2 to step up. I am honestly afraid of Cole a little. I feel that Oliver's contributions from a ball control and rebounding perspective are unappreciated. We need a 2nd guard in the lineup who is gonna take care of the ball. I'm a little afraid of Cole "Rakeem Brookinsing us to death" like in MB3. Good coaches don't allow that. Erase from your memories the years of 2011-2013. Siena was a rudderless ship those three years. If Cole doesn't buy in he won't play it is as simple as that. Cole can be a very good player but if he doesn't improve his shot selection or doesn't play defense - Jimmy will yank him. He can only help and add key depth to the rotation. I originally thought he would start but I think it will be Wright, Poole, Long, Bisping and either JO or Brandwijk. Cole should be a 20-25 minute a game guy as 6th man who will add three point shooting and scoring. Otherwise if we did not get much out of him we'd really need Paige to step up as a frosh (always a dicey situation or a big sophomore jump from Maurice White. Oliver has a knack of hitting clutch shots off the bench. He is our long range 3-point sniper when we need a basket.
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Cole
Jun 24, 2014 16:19:58 GMT -5
Post by Deleted on Jun 24, 2014 16:19:58 GMT -5
My expectations would not change by 1 win. Wright, Poole, Long, and Bisping are the key players. Oliver, Paige, and WB are the potential upside scorers. Everybody else has their jobs and should do it as good or better overall. Cole has upside too but all we need is one or 2 to step up. I am honestly afraid of Cole a little. I feel that Oliver's contributions from a ball control and rebounding perspective are unappreciated. We need a 2nd guard in the lineup who is gonna take care of the ball. I'm a little afraid of Cole "Rakeem Brookinsing us to death" like in MB3. Good coaches don't allow that. Erase from your memories the years of 2011-2013. Siena was a rutterless ship those three years. If Cole doesn't buy in he won't play it is as simple as that. Cole can be a very good player but if he doesn't improve his shot selection or doesn't play defense - Jimmy will yank him. He can only help. I originally thought he would start but I think it will be Wright, Poole, Long, Bisping and either JO or Brandwijk. Cole should be a 20 minute a game guy as 6th man who will add three point shooting and scoring. Otherwise if we did not get much out of him we'd really need Paige to step up as a frosh (always a dicey situation or a big sophomore jump from Maurice White. Oliver has a knack of hitting clutch shots off the bench. He is our long range 3-point sniper when we need a basket. Rememeber in 2012-2013, there were only 5 guys in the entire nation with a higher % of possessions used than Patrick Cole per Kenpom. Momo Jones didn't come close to him. Which means when he's in the game, he IS the game. That worries me a little if he's not playing well. If Wright is dominating the ball like always, then he needs to be surrounded by shooters. I, for one, am putting my eggs more in the Oliver/Paige basket. Paige could need a year to acclimate but if he doesn't....we're fine. I don't want to come out and say that one or the other is gonna make their presence felt. However, I feel pretty confident in one or the other. Cole would help us by attacking the rim and drawing fouls but at what cost? He's never shot particularly stellar at any level. Oliver rebounded better than Poole last year and other than a couple categories, the stats are scary identical. He was a big reason the turnover problems waned in the 2nd half of the year plus he hits threes and clutch shots. He helps just by being in the lineup and not making mistakes. That is very underrated. And he could get better. If the guy is shooting 40% and scoring 8 ppg, you almost have to start him.
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Post by diamonddog on Jun 24, 2014 17:27:41 GMT -5
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Cole
Jun 24, 2014 18:18:28 GMT -5
via mobile
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Post by playerparentcoach on Jun 24, 2014 18:18:28 GMT -5
That is what I was waiting for. It was best coming from him. We just have to hope for the best case scenario.
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Cole
Jun 24, 2014 19:04:14 GMT -5
Post by Deleted on Jun 24, 2014 19:04:14 GMT -5
Pat wouldn't be a true Siena shooting guard if he didn't have health problems. #YouFinallyMadeIt
He'll be fine.
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Cole
Jun 25, 2014 4:38:00 GMT -5
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Post by Tony on Jun 25, 2014 4:38:00 GMT -5
Siena is way better off with Cole than without him- you can quote all the stats you want- I’ve seen him play and he is one of our better players- he is a proven double digit D1 scorer( for point of reference only 15 returning double digit scorers in entire MAAC. Several MAAC teams ( like Manhattan) have no double digit scorers returning
Yes Siena would still be good without Patrick- we do return everyone that finished 5th last year- always dicey if you have to rely on a freshmen, without Cole Siena still has potential to win MAAC but we basically fall back to pack with Manhattan- ST Peters and Quinny all with potential but some major question marks- With Cole- Siena will be either favorite or slight 2nd place pick
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IndianSaint
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Post by IndianSaint on Jun 25, 2014 9:00:13 GMT -5
Good coaches don't allow that. Erase from your memories the years of 2011-2013. Siena was a rutterless ship those three years. If Cole doesn't buy in he won't play it is as simple as that. Cole can be a very good player but if he doesn't improve his shot selection or doesn't play defense - Jimmy will yank him. He can only help. I originally thought he would start but I think it will be Wright, Poole, Long, Bisping and either JO or Brandwijk. Cole should be a 20 minute a game guy as 6th man who will add three point shooting and scoring. Otherwise if we did not get much out of him we'd really need Paige to step up as a frosh (always a dicey situation or a big sophomore jump from Maurice White. Oliver has a knack of hitting clutch shots off the bench. He is our long range 3-point sniper when we need a basket. Rememeber in 2012-2013, there were only 5 guys in the entire nation with a higher % of possessions used than Patrick Cole per Kenpom. Momo Jones didn't come close to him. Which means when he's in the game, he IS the game. That worries me a little if he's not playing well. KK, I hear what you 're saying but Cole's stats for that 1 yr reflected that team's coaching style and the fact that Cole was a Frosh & asked to carry team (a team that wasn't 't that good). I'd be very surprised if Cole plays that way at Siena. One Jimmy won't allow it & two that's what he was asked to do at the other school (otherwise he's other coach couldn't control him). No way Jimmy allows Cole to have those similar numbers/%'s like he did in 2012-13. We have too many other options. That's what I like about this team. If you try and key on one or two guys the other 3 could go off on you. Then we're deeper than most MAAC teams so when their subs are in we shouldn't loose any ground & even possibly increase our lead. It's going to be a fun season to watch.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 25, 2014 10:59:24 GMT -5
Saints are better off with Cole for sure. He seems like a good kid. I'm just not willing to heave the weight of star expectations on his shoulders given his statistical history. Based on the article he feels pressure already. I am not basing it on just one year at Coppin St. Much of his highschool stats are available on maxpreps as well. His shooting woes go back before Coppin. www.maxpreps.com/athlete/patrick-cole/E9USifTqEeKZ5AAmVebBJg/gendersport/basketball-stats.htmHe's a good addition. I like him. He's big and he attacks. I'm just holding a wait and see approach on expectations. Jimmy would do well to limit Cole's three point attempts. He shot closer to what Wright did in HS than Poole or Oliver. He didn't finish all that well from 2 pt range either and usually that % drops once you get to D1. He finished those at just 34% at Coppin. MAAC teams have better interior D than MEAC teams. I know some inefficiences were based on his team's situation but still he has to improve a lot. In addition to what Oliver does, I like Paige because he isn't a volume shooter with how his team uses him, especially not on that Cape Henry team. So when he makes a lot of threes in a game it's because he made most of his shots. And he made a ton of threes a lot last year. The guy quietly puts up points without needing to dominate the ball. He finishes inside and out. When I look at Paige's game, I think this guy should be on Iona. And I thought that way before comparisons were made to Bowman by a couple Iona fans on the MAAC board. It's tough to tell when you've only seen one full game, and then rest is clips, or limited stats...but I've certainly seen enough to be excited. The real question is how will all the PT get sorted out and when. Who will Jimmy go with?
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IndianSaint
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Post by IndianSaint on Jun 25, 2014 12:25:53 GMT -5
Thanks, I didn't realize analysis of numbers also included HS. I still believe Jimmy won't put up with Cole taking poor shots unless he has the OK when shot clock running down. I don't even think he'll be a starter at the beginning if the yr (even before this injury), but believe he has the potential to be a starter by the end of the yr. All depends if he buys into Jimmy's system of taking good shots.
I do like the fact that he can create his own shot anytime he wants which should draw defenders so he can kickback to the open guy.
I still like all the players and can see Ryan getting more mins especially with his play at the end of the season. I liked Page from the little write-ups and video. I think we got a potential steal with him. There isn't anyone on the team I don 't like. Sure some have limitations but as a team we're deeeeepppp, & I like that.
I agree, it's going to be hard to find mins for everyone. That's why I'm still in favor of RSing someone. If no RS, that'll be fine too but PT will be hard to come by for a few at deep positions.
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Cole
Jun 25, 2014 12:42:55 GMT -5
Post by Deleted on Jun 25, 2014 12:42:55 GMT -5
I think if Jimmy uses Cole almost like a combo of Wright and White he'll be good. He played PG well in HS. He gets to the line. Limit the threes and draw fouls. Even if he only finishes at like 38%, he should make up for it at the line.
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SIENA1971
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Post by SIENA1971 on Jun 28, 2014 13:54:52 GMT -5
Good news!
@marksingelais: Siena G Patrick Cole has a sprained MCL and won't require surgery, according to head coach Jimmy Patsos. Out for a month. #sienasaints
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Post by Tony on Jun 28, 2014 14:43:15 GMT -5
Good news! @marksingelais: Siena G Patrick Cole has a sprained MCL and won't require surgery, according to head coach Jimmy Patsos. Out for a month. #sienasaints yeah heard this earlier this week - great news for Siena fans-- bad news for other MAAC team fans
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