albanysaint
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Post by albanysaint on Jun 18, 2013 13:02:02 GMT -5
truth be told, Loyola wasnt exactly loaded the last four or five years. Seems to me that Patsos got a lot out of a roster that wasnt particularly star-studded. I think the recruits he had coming in were the highest ranking of his tenure. Those recruits are now coming to Siena. Expect some turbulance to start but come eventually this team will gel. I expect the results over the next couple of seasons to eventually surpass that of Loyola of the past few seasons.
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musicman
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Post by musicman on Jun 18, 2013 15:36:37 GMT -5
Might be optimistic...but I do think Lavon and Marquis are college ready players right now for sure. We will see about Javion and Mike Wolfe. What made Hasbrouck, Ubiles, Franklin and Moore so good was they produced very quickly and got better. With a competent head coach and offensive system I think you'll see both Long and Wright excel. Of course they'll have some ups and downs as frosh but I think both will be very solid players in their first season at Siena. Will they hit the numbers I projected? It will be interesting but it certainly would not be a surprise. I hate to put too much pressure on them but without Buie it might take those numbers from the freshmen to produce a winning season in 2013-2014. A look at freshmen PPG and Minutes played from notable Siena players. I did not include Rossiter and Jackson because they played in back of so much talent (and in Rossiter's case just not strong enough) their numbers did not stand out. Evan Hymes (13.9, 36.4) Rob Poole (7.0, 27.4) Kenny Hasbrouck (12.4 PPG, 31.5 MPG) Ronald Moore (7.1, 31.1) Edwin Ubiles (11.8, 28.1) Alex Franklin (8.3, 22.4) Michael Haddix (13.8, 26.1) Scoop Jordan (9.0, 26.2) Jack McClinton (13.6, 32.3) Dwayne Archold (7.0, 16.7) Marcus Faison (7.8, 22.5) Corey Osinski (7.3, 21.9) Jim Cantamessa (6.4, 16.9) I think Lavon is the most ready big man Siena has had in a long time. As good as Ubiles was as a freshman, he disappeared at times. He had his weaknesses like all players. I can't see Lavon disappearing in any game. Even if he doesn't score a lot in a certain game, he's so active that he will probably still have close to double digits in rebounds and 5-8 assists. I think it's going to be fun to see who leads the team each game in assists. My money is on Wright, Long or Poole, I don't think Hymes passes the ball well enough to do so.
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musicman
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Post by musicman on Jun 18, 2013 15:38:07 GMT -5
Might be optimistic...but I do think Lavon and Marquis are college ready players right now for sure. We will see about Javion and Mike Wolfe. What made Hasbrouck, Ubiles, Franklin and Moore so good was they produced very quickly and got better. With a competent head coach and offensive system I think you'll see both Long and Wright excel. Of course they'll have some ups and downs as frosh but I think both will be very solid players in their first season at Siena. Will they hit the numbers I projected? It will be interesting but it certainly would not be a surprise. I hate to put too much pressure on them but without Buie it might take those numbers from the freshmen to produce a winning season in 2013-2014. A look at freshmen PPG and Minutes played from notable Siena players. I did not include Rossiter and Jackson because they played in back of so much talent (and in Rossiter's case just not strong enough) their numbers did not stand out. Evan Hymes (13.9, 36.4) Rob Poole (7.0, 27.4) Kenny Hasbrouck (12.4 PPG, 31.5 MPG) Ronald Moore (7.1, 31.1) Edwin Ubiles (11.8, 28.1) Alex Franklin (8.3, 22.4) Michael Haddix (13.8, 26.1) Scoop Jordan (9.0, 26.2) Jack McClinton (13.6, 32.3) Dwayne Archold (7.0, 16.7) Marcus Faison (7.8, 22.5) Corey Osinski (7.3, 21.9) Jim Cantamessa (6.4, 16.9) I think Lavon is the most ready big man Siena has had in a long time. As good as Ubiles was as a freshman, he disappeared at times. He had his weaknesses like all players. I can't see Lavon disappearing in any game. Even if he doesn't score a lot in a certain game, he's so active that he will probably still have close to double digits in rebounds and 5-8 assists. I think it's going to be fun to see who leads the team each game in assists. My money is on Wright, Long or Poole, I don't think Hymes passes the ball well enough to do so.
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musicman
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Post by musicman on Jun 18, 2013 15:49:25 GMT -5
truth be told, Loyola wasnt exactly loaded the last four or five years. Seems to me that Patsos got a lot out of a roster that wasnt particularly star-studded. I think the recruits he had coming in were the highest ranking of his tenure. Those recruits are now coming to Siena. Expect some turbulance to start but come eventually this team will gel. I expect the results over the next couple of seasons to eventually surpass that of Loyola of the past few seasons. I think you're exactly right about his recruits. We're seeing the fruition of his 9 years. Pretty impressive! I agree also about some bumps in the road, there always are. But, I can't believe we won't score at least 6-10 more points a game than what we had last year. Hell, we could have scored 3-5 points more per game with just mediocre foul shooting.
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$cott
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Post by $cott on Jun 18, 2013 15:51:25 GMT -5
Might be optimistic...but I do think Lavon and Marquis are college ready players right now for sure. We will see about Javion and Mike Wolfe. What made Hasbrouck, Ubiles, Franklin and Moore so good was they produced very quickly and got better. With a competent head coach and offensive system I think you'll see both Long and Wright excel. Of course they'll have some ups and downs as frosh but I think both will be very solid players in their first season at Siena. Will they hit the numbers I projected? It will be interesting but it certainly would not be a surprise. I hate to put too much pressure on them but without Buie it might take those numbers from the freshmen to produce a winning season in 2013-2014. A look at freshmen PPG and Minutes played from notable Siena players. I did not include Rossiter and Jackson because they played in back of so much talent (and in Rossiter's case just not strong enough) their numbers did not stand out. Evan Hymes (13.9, 36.4) Rob Poole (7.0, 27.4) Kenny Hasbrouck (12.4 PPG, 31.5 MPG) Ronald Moore (7.1, 31.1) Edwin Ubiles (11.8, 28.1) Alex Franklin (8.3, 22.4) Michael Haddix (13.8, 26.1) Scoop Jordan (9.0, 26.2) Jack McClinton (13.6, 32.3) Dwayne Archold (7.0, 16.7) Marcus Faison (7.8, 22.5) Corey Osinski (7.3, 21.9) Jim Cantamessa (6.4, 16.9) I think Lavon is the most ready big man Siena has had in a long time. As good as Ubiles was as a freshman, he disappeared at times. He had his weaknesses like all players. I can't see Lavon disappearing in any game. Even if he doesn't score a lot in a certain game, he's so active that he will probably still have close to double digits in rebounds and 5-8 assists. I think it's going to be fun to see who leads the team each game in assists. My money is on Wright, Long or Poole, I don't think Hymes passes the ball well enough to do so. If I can be guaranteed 2.5 Assists per game from Long right now I would take it in a heartbeat.
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musicman
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Post by musicman on Jun 18, 2013 16:08:08 GMT -5
I think Lavon is the most ready big man Siena has had in a long time. As good as Ubiles was as a freshman, he disappeared at times. He had his weaknesses like all players. I can't see Lavon disappearing in any game. Even if he doesn't score a lot in a certain game, he's so active that he will probably still have close to double digits in rebounds and 5-8 assists. I think it's going to be fun to see who leads the team each game in assists. My money is on Wright, Long or Poole, I don't think Hymes passes the ball well enough to do so. If I can be guaranteed 2.5 Assists per game from Long right now I would take it in a heartbeat. I hear what you're saying but I think he's going to average 4-5 per. When you watch all those videos, it's amazing the way he sees the floor, and he really is a tremendous passer. He's so aggressive going to the hoop but he's always looking for the man coming to the hoop. Think about how few big men we have had in recent years that can dish off like he can, Franklin, loved him but this kid has a better handle maybe even now. For our team, I hope I'm right.
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$cott
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Post by $cott on Jun 18, 2013 16:17:46 GMT -5
If I can be guaranteed 2.5 Assists per game from Long right now I would take it in a heartbeat. I hear what you're saying but I think he's going to average 4-5 per. When you watch all those videos, it's amazing the way he sees the floor, and he really is a tremendous passer. He's so aggressive going to the hoop but he's always looking for the man coming to the hoop. Think about how few big men we have had in recent years that can dish off like he can, Franklin, loved him but this kid has a better handle maybe even now. For our team, I hope I'm right. 3 listed forwards in the MAAC averaged more than 1.8 assists per game last year. Anthony Winbush (2.5 APG), Emmy Andujar (2.5 APG), and Chauvaghn Lewis (2.7 APG) and Lewis is listed as a G-F. So yeah, I would be ecstatic with 2.5 APG from Long as a freshman.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 18, 2013 16:21:03 GMT -5
I think you're exactly right about his recruits. We're seeing the fruition of his 9 years. Pretty impressive! I agree also about some bumps in the road, there always are. But, I can't believe we won't score at least 6-10 more points a game than what we had last year. Hell, we could have scored 3-5 points more per game with just mediocre foul shooting. The mediocre foul shooting was one guy. The rest of the team shot 73% last year. It was funny when Mitch credited himself for the uptick in FT% during latter stages of the year. It was only because OD was making more while taking less during that period. As far as this class being better than all of Patsos' previous classes, that's just Siena wishful thinking right there. I do like these guys but, let's be real, these are MAAC level recruits. Our expectations should be tempered until we see something from them. The good thing is that they all seem to have good handles for their positions. Wolfe for instance seems to handle it pretty well for a 6-9 guy. If you have a handle and athleticism, you can work with the other stuff.
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Post by playerparentcoach on Jun 18, 2013 17:30:06 GMT -5
Lavon loves to pass he was averaging over 3 asst most of last year the pg missed 10 games ...he ended up averaging 2.5 his teammates did not always convert at a high rate ...playing with the shooters and an active Big I can see 4 or 5 asst games
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 18, 2013 17:40:34 GMT -5
I think Lavon will average 2.73564 assists per game exactly with a slight chance to improve to 2.73565 if he really puts the extra work in.
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gorvy
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Post by gorvy on Jun 18, 2013 19:48:47 GMT -5
Scoring is not that important to me, as the overall quality of college basketball across the board is way down due to the over abundance of Division 1 teams. I expect this downward trend to continue, so scoring expectations should be low. In the end, myself and I am sure most on here will be focusing on the only stat that matters-- wins.
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Post by playerparentcoach on Jun 18, 2013 20:14:27 GMT -5
I think Lavon will average 2.73564 assists per game exactly with a slight chance to improve to 2.73565 if he really puts the extra work in.
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Post by SaintsFan on Jun 19, 2013 7:06:52 GMT -5
Scoring is not that important to me, as the overall quality of college basketball across the board is way down due to the over abundance of Division 1 teams. I expect this downward trend to continue, so scoring expectations should be low. In the end, myself and I am sure most on here will be focusing on the only stat that matters-- wins. I dont know if I agree about the number of teams being the issue. I think at all levels, fundamentals are sorely lacking. Everyone wants to high-fly and dunk. Forget about free throws, 12-18 ft jump shouts... heck some of these kids can dunk but struggle to make layups.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 19, 2013 9:13:58 GMT -5
If Buie is eligible, I hope Jimmy basically tells him not to shoot threes. Have him attack the rim next year and let guys like Hymes, Poole, Bisping, Oliver etc. shoot.
If Poole stays heathly and Lavon plays with Hymes, Wright, Poole, and Buie most of the time then that's 5 guys who could potentially attempt over 100 FTs because of their ability to attack. Poole still attempted 89 FTs last year even though he missed 4 games, lost 20 lbs midseason, and seemed to not be involved enough at times.
Jimmy's recent teams tended to get to the line a lot. 2nd in MAAC last year, 1st the year before. I look forward to a hopefully increased team points per shot (PPS) stat. Loyola didn't even shoot 30% from three with a mediocre FG% last year and still had a significantly higher PPS than Siena. The FG% during their recent 2 year run was just 42.8% yet they still won 47 games in 2 years. Loyola had a ton of obstacles last year too with Etherly's injury, RJ's suspension, and Olsen forgetting how to shoot. They still won.
That FG% is not really a whole lot different from Mitch's career Siena numbers (41.4%) but the record clearly is. Free throws made and defense may be the key to this year and the main difference between Mitch and Jimmy.
Jimmy hasn't had this many shooters in years and Silas finished at the rim at a 60% clip last year. If Lavon and the other guards take enough pressure off of Silas so that he still has room to work his pivots then Siena's FG% and 3pt shooting % should, in theory, be even better than Loyola's was last year. (Etherly finished at only a 43% clip last year.) If he can create some semblence of a defense anchored by Long and Silas, this team can be at the top of the league.
If the defense falls apart and the wrong guys start gunning and turning the ball over then we're a sure-fire PIG team again.
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SaintMisbehavin
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Post by SaintMisbehavin on Jun 19, 2013 9:26:40 GMT -5
If Buie is eligible, I hope Jimmy basically tells him not to shoot threes. Have him attack the rim next year and let guys like Hymes, Poole, Bisping, Oliver etc. shoot. If Poole stays heathly and Lavon plays with Hymes, Wright, Poole, and Buie most of the time then that's 5 guys who could potentially attempt over 100 FTs because of their ability to attack. Poole still attempted 89 FTs last year even though he missed 4 games, lost 20 lbs midseason, and seemed to not be involved enough at times. Jimmy's recent teams tended to get to the line a lot. 2nd in MAAC last year, 1st the year before. I look forward to a hopefully increased team points per shot (PPS) stat. Loyola didn't even shoot 30% from three with a mediocre FG% last year and still had a significantly higher PPS than Siena. The FG% during their recent 2 year run was just 42.8% yet they still won 47 games in 2 years. Loyola had a ton of obstacles last year too with Etherly's injury, RJ's suspension, and Olsen forgetting how to shoot. They still won. That FG% is not really a whole lot different from Mitch's career Siena numbers (41.4%) but the record clearly is. Free throws made and defense may be the key to this year and the main difference between Mitch and Jimmy. Jimmy hasn't had this many shooters in years and Silas finished at the rim at a 60% clip last year. If Lavon and the other guards take enough pressure off of Silas so that he still has room to work his pivots then Siena's FG% and 3pt shooting % should, in theory, be even better than Loyola's was last year. (Etherly finished at only a 43% clip last year.) If he can create some semblence of a defense anchored by Long and Silas, this team can be at the top of the league. If the defense falls apart and the wrong guys start gunning and turning the ball over then we're a sure-fire PIG team again. Don't disagree with the outlook. The stat you're looking for, essentially, is "Points Per Possession" or PPP. It's also sometimes calculated in tempo-free circles as Offensive Efficiency.
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